Nov 25, 2024 Planning

[I. ROLL CALL]

[00:00:06]

YEAH. GOOD EVENING. MONTGOMERY TOWNSHIP PLANNING BOARD, MONTGOMERY TOWNSHIP, SOMERSET COUNTY, NEW JERSEY, REGULAR MEETING NOVEMBER 25TH, 2024. IT IS THE PLANNING BOARD'S INTENTION TO CONCLUDE THIS MEETING NO LATER THAN 10 P.M. THE TIME IS 7:02 P.M. OPENING STATEMENT. UNDER THE PROVISIONS OF THE OPEN PUBLIC MEETINGS ACT. NOTICE OF THE TIME AND PLACE OF THIS MEETING HAS BEEN POSTED AND SENT TO THE OFFICIALLY DESIGNATED NEWSPAPERS. ROLL CALL PLEASE. CAMPUS MONEY. YES. BATTLE. BLODGETT HERE. HAMILTON. HERE. KEENAN. HERE. MATTHEWS.

HERE. ROBERTS. SINGH. GLOCKLER. KHAN. CASEY. HERE. DARCY. PRESENT. SULLIVAN HERE AND BARTOLONE HERE. THANYOU. AK ND I'GOING M NOTETO THAT ROBER TS COMINISING N.OW THA YOUNK.

THE E T FGLA. THANKOU. Y AGFL OTHE UNF EDITTATES S WHICICA.AMND A TO THREPUBLE FOC ITH SNDS. OTA NATIONE NDERUN GODINDIVI, BLE, WSIH Y A JUSTIND FOR ACELL.

NOT PPUTICIPAARON FORTITEMS I THE AONNDA.GE SUBJE TOCT RESPTIDION OF THCHAIR,E E W PUBLLYECSK MEM ARS OFBE THE TOIC LIMITHEIR C TMENTSOM AND ORUESTIO QAND ANN ERSSW TO COMMINUTVE WHENESROVIDI PNG T FOR ENEMS NOITT ON TH PLEAA OAGR F ANORPPLICA AON.TI STATESEOUR Y NE AND AMUR AME N FOR T RECORHE IFD. Y OUEFER NPR TOOT PROVI YOURDE ADESS, PDRASELE ADVE WHICIS APPLIPAMUTY YOULIIVE IN L. OKAY. ATION ICNTINUACOONTI. CA.

[IV. APPLICATION CONTINUATION TO THE DECEMBER 9, 2024 PLANNING BOARD MEETING]

[V. RESOLUTIONS ]

KEAN.ENES. MO YY. YESNE .TTHEWSMA. YES. ROBTS. YEER S.NGH. YSI.ES TNK YOUHA. OKAY.

CA. PB DSEHASERO TH ZE. DASREH ICANT PL MARKISFEIL. P BLKOC IS 19. LOT 01UR,FO DH SUBD 206. TENORMI ISIONIV WH VARIITCEAN. AND TH ISIS AO A MOLSON TOTI MORIALMEE BOARIZMEMBERD S. I THK YOUINAD AN HRLIER EARSIONVE OF THIRESOLUS ON. SOTIHAT W UPDAGIVE'VYOUN TONHT IS IGA D FORMTEF IT O. ANYOU'LLD SEEINOR C MNGES WHACHHIRE TED ONGHAGE ON PE. TWO. I NE FIRSTHTWOT PARAGPHS ANRA DEN THETH PARAGPH UNDRA LABELER EDRKMA FAIL.AGE TH PE. WERE JT CORRE AION INCTHE T NAMOF NEERINGIG FM. PAGIRE FOU R.AIN, MAGORIN. MIR CORRNOTIONSC UNLTIE GET W CONDITOONTI NUMRBE SI THIS X.S THEWAAINTEN MCE ERVATIES OFON THEEDGERO H WONG THALE HORAM ROASHFRONTAD . N COMM OTS FROENSTAFFM AN AL SENONNCETE H BEENAS ADD PROVDEINGID THAT OULD TSH HEWNSHIPTO DIDE TECO UERTAKEND WOULN THRKE RIGHTF WAY, OHICH W RESULTD IN THNEED FE OR REVAL OFMOHE HED TROW,GE THE N WOULIONO LOND RGEE B LE. SOAB THEREAS SOM W ENCERNCO TTHA BMAKINGY

[00:05:08]

THE NE. XTNE. TH OAMENDEE DDAN PREMINARYLI INVESGATIONTIF A INEED ON REDEVEF PMENTLO CONDEORATIONMN FOR BLOCK 28010. LOTS 59, 61, 62 AND 64. FORMERLY KNOWN AS PHASE TWO GATEWAY DEVELOPMENT. AND THIS IS ALSO A MOTION TO MEMORIALIZE FROM LAST TIME. I THINK MANY OF US. ANY QUESTIONS OR ANY CHANGES IN THAT CASE? NO, NO. OKAY. I'LL MOVE. MOTION. TO GO. ANYBODY? SECOND.

SECOND. YEP. AND I DON'T THINK. I DON'T THINK YOU CAN. NO, NO. YEAH. YEAH. NO, HE CANNOT SAY THAT. YUP. YUP. IN FACT. YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. YEAH. THAT'S FINE. ROLL CALL PLEASE. KEENAN. YES.

MANI. YES. MATTHEWS. YES. ROBERTS. YES. AND. SINGH. YES. YES. THANK YOU. NUMBER FIVE.

[VI. ORDINANCE RECOMMENDATION ]

[00:10:09]

COUNTY OF SOMERSET. STATE OF NEW JERSEY WITH SECTION 1615. FLOODPLAIN MANAGEMENT REGULATIONS AND SECTION 1616 CRITICAL AREAS. THIS IS FROM THE PREVIOUS, I THINK, LAST BUT ONE, RIGHT. WE HAVE THAT. WELL, I MEAN THIS THIS IS IN FRONT OF YOU BECAUSE IT'S AN AMENDMENT TO THE LAND USE ORDINANCE. SO IT IT COMES TO YOU FOR REVIEW AND COMPLIANCE WITH THE MASTER PLAN.

IS THIS FOR THE NEW NJ REAL? YES. SO THIS IS FEMA REQUIRED NJDEP TO UPDATE THEIR MODEL ORDINANCE. YEP. SO WE HAD TO CLEAN UP INCONSISTENCIES AND BRING OUR ORDINANCE IN CONFORMANCE WITH THAT. IT JUST MELDS TOGETHER THE FEDERAL STA TEILDINGBU CES MAKOD SUREES TH'REEY ALL CSISTENON AND IT.ST' DANCE ORTH THAWITEW DINANCORE. OKA YEPY.

.UNDS GSODOO. OK. I'LLAYAKE M SECOONMO TO PA THE OSSINANCERD.I . ROLLNDALL. C RDY? ROEA LLLL PLECAE.AS BLODGT. YESET. HALTON. MIS. KEEYEN. YESNA. ROBE. TTHEWSMAYES..

S.RT Y.ES SIN. YES.GHND CASES.HANK Y TOU. APPLITIONCA PB. DA. SHERO FI Z. DASHVE

[VI. APPLICATION ]

SOE APPLTHANTIC PRESEATION NTI ESS. GGUD EVENOOG. TOMIN LETIZIA, ATTORNEY WITH TROUTMAN PEPPER HAMILTON SANDERS, REPRESENTING THE APPLICANT. MOUNT PENN SC, LLC, WHICH IS THE APPLICANT IN THIS MATTER, AS WELL AS THE OWNER OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY MONT PENN SC IS AN AFFILIATE OF HILTON REALTY. AND THIS CASE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW OUR NOTICE AFFIDAVITS. IT'S IN ORDER AND THEY'RE IN ORDER. OKAY. THANK YOU. BOARD HAS JURISDICTION. JUST A LITTLE BACKGROUND. THE PROPERTY WE WILL BE DISCUSSING TONIGHT IS BLOCK 29 002. LOT 46. IT IS IN THE HC HIGHWAY COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT AND HAS A STREET ADDRESS OF 1325 ROUTE 206. I'M SURE YOU'RE VERY FAMILIAR WITH THE SITE. IT HAS BEEN DEVELOPED FOR DECADES AS THE MONTGOMERY SHOPPING CENTER SENIOR HOUSING WAS CONSTRUCTED IN THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY. IN THE 1990S. WE ARE VERY EXCITED TO BE HERE THIS EVENING TO PRESENT THIS APPLICATION FOR IMPROVEMENTS TO THE SHOPPING CENTER. THE PLANS YOU WILL SEE REPRESENT A COLLABORATIVE EFFORT BETWEEN THE APPLICANT AND ITS CONSULTANTS, THE BOARD, STAFF AND CONSULTANTS, AND THE SITE PLAN REVIEW COMMITTEE. WE APPEARED BEFORE THE COMMITTEE TWICE BACK IN EARLY SEPTEMBER, AND ALSO IN EARLY OCTOBER, AND WE HAVE INCORPORATED CHANGES THAT WERE DISCUSSED DURING THOSE MEETINGS. WE THINK YOU WILL BE PLEASED WITH THE PROPOSED UPGRADES TO THE CENTER, AND AGREE THAT THEY REPRESENT THE APPLICANT'S STRONG COMMITMENT TO THE COMMUNITY AND ITS TENANTS. THE APPLICATION IS SEEKING MINOR SITE PLAN APPROVAL WITH VARIANCES FOR THE COMMERCIAL PORTION OF THE SITE, AND THESE INCLUDE AN UPGRADE OF THE BUILDING FACADES OF THE SHOPPING CENTER, A NEW TENANT, SIGNAGE ON THE UPGRADED FACADES, A CONVERSION OF FOUR EXISTING PARKING SPACES TO EV PARKING SPACES, AND THIS WILL ACTUALLY RESULT IN A FOUR PARKING SPACE.

[00:15:03]

THE FOURTH VARIANCE IS FROM TOWNSHIP ORDINANCE SECTION 16, DASH 4.12 E7B2, WHICH REQUIRES WINDOWS SMALLER THAN 75% OF THE FACADE AREA BE OUTLINED IN A MATERIAL TO AN AREA EQUIVALENT TO 75%. IN OTHER WORDS, SHOWING SORT OF FAUX WINDOW. OUR UNDERSIDE WINDOWS ARE NOT SO OUTLINED, AND WE'LL SHOW YOU THAT IN THE REASONS WHY. THE FIFTH VARIANCE IS FROM TOWNSHIP ORDINANCE SECTION 16 DASH 4.12 POINT I TO BE ONE, WHICH PERMITS THE FIRST FLOOR USE IN A BUILDING IN THE ZONE WITH DIRECT ACCESS FROM THE OUTSIDE TO HAVE AN ATTACHED SIGN WITH AN AREA NOT TO EXCEED A HALF A SQUARE FOOT OF SIGN AREA PER LINEAR FOOT OF FACADE OCCUPIED BY THE USER UP TO A MAXIMUM OF 50FT■!S. WE ARE PROPOSING A TOTAL OF 41 NEW TENANT SIGNS, AND 32 OF THOSE SIGNS ARE LARGER THAN THE AREA ALLOWED BY THE ORDINANCE, AND I WILL NOT LIST ALL 32 SIGNS THAT REQUIRE VARIANCES. MR. SULLIVAN PROVIDES A COMPREHENSIVE LISTING OF THE

[00:20:07]

THE NEXT VARIANCE IS FROM SECTION 16 DASH 4.12 I2B3, WHICH REQUIRES ALL SIGNS IN A SHOPPING CENTER TO ADHERE TO A COMMON ARCHITECTURAL THEME REGARDING LETTERING, STYLE, LIGHTING, AND COLOR. THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING A LETTER, STYLE AND COLOR TO VARY BY TENANT. ALL THE SIGNS WILL BE COMPOSED OF FACE LIT CHANNEL LETTERS ON A NON ILLUMINATED WHITE BACKER PANEL, AS PERMITTED BY ORDINANCE, AND WE WILL EXPLAIN WHY. WE THINK VARIATION IN THE SIGNAGE IS IMPORTANT FOR THIS PARTICULAR CENTER. AND THEN WE HAVE TWO ADDITIONAL VARIANCES RELATED. T.

SIGN HEIGHT. ONE IS FROM SECTION 16 DASH 5.13 D FOUR, WHICH LIMITS THE MAXIMUM HEIGHT OF ATTACHED SIGNS TO 20FT ABOVE GRADE 16 OF THE PROPOSED TENNIS SIGNS WILL BE LOCATED HIGHER THAN 20FT ABOVE GRADE. THE NONCONFORMING SIGN HEIGHTS RANGE FROM 20FT ONE INCH, WHICH ACTUALLY WE COULD PROBABLY COMPLY AND REMOVE THE ONE, ELIMINATE THE ONE INCH. BUT THERE IS A SIGN THAT GOES UP TO 24FT FOUR INCHES ABOVE GRADE. AND THEN THE LAST VARIANCE IS FROM SECTION 16 DASH 5.13 D SEVEN, WHICH ALLOWS FOR THE CONTINUATION BUT NOT THE RELOCATION OF NONCONFORMING SIGNS. WE ARE PROPOSING RELOCATING THE EXISTING SHOPRITE MEDALLION SIGN TO 25FT FOUR INCHES ABOVE GRADE. BECAUSE WE THINK THAT IS MORE APPROPRIATE GIVING GIVEN THE FACADE CHANGES. WE'RE PROPOSING AND THEREFORE WE NEED A VARIANCE FROM THAT ORDINANCE SECTION. THERE IS A DESIGN WAIVER REQUEST. IT'S NOT A VARIANCE BUT A DESIGN WAIVER FROM YOUR SITE PLAN REQUIREMENTS RELATED TO GROUND LEVEL ILLUMINATION, WHICH WHICH MANDATES THAT PURSUANT TO SECTION 16 DASH 5.4 B TWO, WE NOT EXCEED THE GROUND LEVEL ILLUMINATION LEVEL OF ONE FOOT CANDLE. AND WE WILL EXPLAIN WHY WE'RE NOT ABLE TO DO THAT. BUT WE THINK THE PROPOSED ILLUMINATION LEVELS ARE APPROPRIATE. AND THERE IS A ALSO A REQUIREMENT THAT LIGHTING BE TURNED OFF AFTER BUSINESS HOURS. AS HAS BEEN THE CASE FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME. THE CENTER LIGHTS DO REMAIN ON AT 100%. NOT ALL THE LIGHTS WILL POINT OUT WHICH ONES DO. DURING THE NIGHT AND THEN THERE ARE OTHER LIGHTS THAT DIM TO 50% OVERNIGHT.

AGAIN, THIS IS FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY REASONS AND WE'LL EXPLAIN WITHIN OUR PRESENTATION.

WE TRUST YOU WILL FIND THAT THE REQUESTED RELIEF DOES SATISFY THE C ONE AND C TWO VARIANCE CRITERIA, BECAUSE THE LIMITATIONS RESULTING FROM THE STRUCTURAL FEATURES OF THE EXISTING BUILDINGS. AFTER ALL, WE ARE TRYING TO IMPLEMENT A FACELIFT TO AN EXISTING SHOPPING CENTER THAT'S BEEN ON SITE FOR DECADES. RATHER THAN DEMOLISHING BUILDINGS AND START FROM SCRATCH. SO HOPEFULLY YOU WILL TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION. AND FURTHER, WE THINK THE BENEFITS THAT ARE REALIZED BY GRANTING THE VARIANCES SUBSTANTIALLY OUTWEIGH ANY DETRIMENTS. IN FACT, WE DON'T THINK THERE ARE ANY DETRIMENTS RESULTING FROM THE VARIANCE RELIEF AND JUST THE SITE. FOR THE RECORD, WE BELIEVE THAT THE FOLLOWING PURPOSES OF ZONING AS SET FORTH IN THE MUNICIPAL LAND USE LAW ARE MET BY THIS APPLICATION, THAT IS, TO ENCOURAGE MUNICIPAL ACTION TO GUIDE THE APPROPRIATE USE AND DEVELOPMENT OF ALL LANDS IN THE STATE IN A MANNER THAT WILL PROMOTE THE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, MORALS AND GENERAL WELFARE, AND THEN PURPOSE AI TO PROMOTE A DESIRABLE VISUAL ENVIRONMENT. TO CREATE A DEVELOPMENT TECHNIQUES AND GOOD CIVIC DESIGN AND ARRANGEMENT. IN TERMS OF THE REVIEW MEMOS THAT WE RECEIVED. WE HAVE REVIEWED THE MALL, THE NOVEMBER 22ND REVIEW MEMORANDUM OF CLARK AND HENCE SEPTEMBER 18TH, 2020 FOR REVIEW. LETTER OF ENVIRONMENTAL RESOLUTIONS INCORPORATING THE

[00:25:01]

IT'S A CORPORATE REQUIREMENT. WE DON'T HAVE A CHOICE AT THIS POINT TO CHANGE IT. THEN WE WANTED TO INCORPORATE FEATURES THAT AT LEAST MAKE IT FEEL CONSISTENT, ALTHOUGH WE DIDN'T WANT IT TO LOOK LIKE THIS IS AA4 BUILDING SHOP RIGHT, EITHER. SO IT'S NOT JUST COPYING THOSE PIECES, BUT HOPEFULLY BLENDING IT BETTER. WE ALSO HAVE CERTAIN EXISTING MATERIALS THAT ARE

[00:30:03]

AND YOU CAN SEE THAT WHAT WE'VE DONE IS TO SHOW THE EXISTING CONDITIONS AT THE TOP. AND THEN WE'RE SHOWING THE PROPOSED DESIGN. AND IN THE NEXT LAYER DOWN IS THE SAME DESIGN, BUT WITH THE LOCATION FOR SIGNAGE ON THE, ON THE FACADE. WHICH BUILDING IS THIS? THIS ONE IS, THIS IS BUILDING A. SO THE ONES TO THE LEFT, AS YOU PULL IN THIS THIS FACILITY, THIS PARTICULAR BUILDING HAS THE CINEMA AS AN ANCHOR ON THE LEFT OR CLOSEST TO THE STREET. AND THEN YOU CAN SEE SOME OF THE, THE PITCHED ROOFS THAT ARE EXISTING RIGHT NOW. WHAT WE'VE TRIED TO DO, AND AS WAS MENTIONED BEFORE, THIS IS A FACELIFT. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO AS A FACELIFT FOR A BUILDING THAT IS PRETTY WELL OCCUPIED ALREADY, WE HAVE TO DO THIS WORK AROUND THESE OPERATIONAL STORES. SO THE DESIGN IDEA THAT WE HAVE HERE IS TO MAKE USE OF THE EXISTING CANOPY WITHOUT REMOVING IT. SO WE ARE ADDING, AS I'M GOING TO SAY, ABOUT 90% OF THE ENTIRE FACILITY IS GOING TO BE DONE AS AN ADDITIVE PROCESS TO THE EXISTING CANOPY. THIS WILL ALLOW THAT EXISTING CANOPY TO FUNCTION AS THE SAFETY OVER THE PEDESTRIAN WALKWAY THROUGH THE DURATION OF THE CONSTRUCTION. NOW, OF COURSE, WE DO NEED TO REPLACE WINDOWS. WE NEED TO REPLACE CERTAIN MATERIALS. SO THERE'LL BE TIMES WHEN SEGMENTS ARE CLOSED DOWN AND WE'LL TRY TO DO THIS IN CONCERT WITH SCHEDULES FOR THE BUSINESSES AND SO ON. BUT THE IDEA OF BEING ABLE TO MAKE USE OF THAT AS A SAFETY FEATURE. SAFETY HAS BEEN A PRIMARY FUNCTION OF A LOT OF OUR DECISIONS IN WHAT WE'VE WE'VE PROPOSED HERE. AND THAT'S A LARGE ONE. SO YOU CAN SEE THEN IN EACH LOCATION WHERE WE HAVE THESE PITCHED ROOFS, WHICH INCIDENTALLY EARLIER PROJECT OR EARLIER PROPOSALS DID NOT HAVE THE PITCHED ROOFS. AND THE PITCHED ROOFS CAME IN FROM SUGGESTIONS MADE BY YOUR PLAN REVIEW COMMITTEE. AND I THINK IT REALLY IMPROVED THE ESTHETIC OF THIS FACADE. AND IT BROUGHT IN SOME OF THE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS THAT MAKE IT A BIT MORE CONTEXTUAL, I THINK, AS WELL TO OTHER FACILITIES IN THE GENERAL AREA. SO BUT THOSE, THOSE PITCHED ROOFS ARE THE EXISTING STRUCTURE RECLAD IN NEW MATERIALS. AND THEN THE LARGER ELEMENTS, THESE, THESE ELEMENTS RIGHT HERE ARE ALL FRAMED ON TOP OF IT. BUT SO TOO ARE THESE PARAPET WALLS HERE. SO THOSE ARE REALLY JUST BRINGING THE PARAPET A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO THE FRONT. AND SO THE BOTTOM OF THAT PARAPET COMES DOWN THE PITCHED ROOF AND GIVES A LITTLE BIT MORE FACADE TO IT THAN IS EXISTING RIGHT NOW. OR A LITTLE LESS OF THE PITCH, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

BUT IT'S ALL ADDITIVE CONSTRUCTION ON TOP OF THAT, THAT CURRENT PITCHED ROOF, I'M GOING TO GO TO A LITTLE BIT LARGER AND ENLARGED VERSION OF THE SAME BUILDING, SO YOU CAN SEE A LITTLE BIT BETTER THE WAY THESE ELEMENTS ARE, ARE BUILT OUT. WE'VE USED ALL OF OUR EXISTING COLUMN LOCATIONS. NONE OF THEM ARE BEING REMOVED OR MOVED. WE ARE RECLADDING THEM.

WE'RE GIVING THEM A LITTLE A LITTLE BIT MORE HEFT. SO WE'RE GOING TO ADD NEW BRICK AROUND THE PERIMETER. AT THE BASE, WE'RE GOING TO ADD A CAST STONE BASE. SO IT'S VERY DURABLE. AND THEN WE WILL BE CLADDING THE EXISTING BRICK THAT'S BEHIND ON THE, ON THE ACTUAL INTERIOR ENCLOSURE WALL AT THE BACK OF THE PEDESTRIAN WALK AREA. AND THEN THESE ELEMENTS THAT ARE UP ABOVE WHICH ARE WELL OUT OF REACH OF PEDESTRIANS OR PATRONS, THOSE ARE CLAD IN A MIX OF MATERIALS. THERE'S EFIS ON SOME OF THE STRAIGHT FLAT FACADES. YOU CAN SEE AS THIS SORT OF HATCHED AREAS. HERE WE HAVE STANDING SEAM METAL ROOFING ON THE PITCHED ROOFS, AND WE HAVE IN SOME LOCATIONS WE'RE DOTTING IN SOME OF THESE AREAS WHERE WE'RE PUTTING A FAUX WOOD TO GIVE SOME MORE WARMTH TO THE FACADE. IT'S A PRODUCT CALLED NICHIHA, WHICH IS A VERY GOOD QUALITY VERSION OF THIS. IT'S VERY WELL FOAD IF YOU WILL. IT DOESN'T HAVE MUCH OF A PATTERN

[00:35:05]

I'VE USED IT WITH GREAT SUCCESS IN MANY OTHER APPLICATIONS, SO I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH THE WAY IT'LL FUNCTION. AND THEN THAT SAME SET OF TOOLS AND RULES HAVE BEEN USED TO DEFINE EACH OF THE BUILDINGS. AND I'LL SHOW YOU THOSE IN A MOMENT. THEN WHEN IT COMES TO THE WINDOWS, THE WINDOWS AGAIN, AS WE'RE TRYING TO MINIMIZE THE IMPACT TO THE FUNCTIONING STORES, THE OPERATIONAL STORES, IT REALLY BECOMES VERY IMPRACTICAL TO TRY AND CHANGE THE WIDTH OF THE WINDOWS. IT'S A VERY INVASIVE PROCESS. YOU HAVE TO REMOVE THE STRUCTURE THAT IS THE HEADER OVER THE WINDOWS, AND THOSE HEADERS ARE HOLDING UP THE EXISTING ROOF AND THE EXISTING CANOPY THAT WE'RE USING FOR NOT ONLY OUR BASE STRUCTURE, BUT OUR SAFETY TO THE PEDESTRIANS DURING THAT PROCESS. SO WHAT WE PROPOSE TO DO, IN ORDER TO INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF GLASS ON THE FACADE, IS TO TAKE THOSE SAME OPENINGS, THE SAME WIDTH, BUT CUT THEM DOWN MUCH CLOSER TO THE FLOOR SO THAT WE CAN INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF GLASS THAT WE HAVE. MAKE A BIT BOLDER STATEMENT OUT OF THE GRID, THE WHICH WE'RE NOW GOING TO MAKE A BLACK METAL OR BLACK ALUMINUM GRID. AND I THINK IT WILL COME ACROSS AS A CONSIDERABLY LARGER AMOUNT OF GLASS. AND WHILE IT DOES NOT REACH THE GOAL OF THE 75%, YOU'RE CERTAINLY GOING IN THAT DIRECTION. IT WAS NOTED IN THE REVIEW LETTER FROM MR. SULLIVAN, EACH OF THEM, EACH OF THE FACADES AND THE PERCENTAGE THAT WE'VE REACHED, THEY ARE, AS I SAID, LESS THAN THE 75, BUT CERTAINLY AN IMPROVEMENT OVER WHAT WE HAVE TODAY. AND I THINK YOU CAN SEE WHEN YOU LOOK AT THESE FACADES, THERE'S STILL A FEEL OF A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF GLASS. BEYOND THAT, THE REMAINING WALLS, THEN, ARE THE EXISTING BRICK AND AGAIN, IT'S VERY COST PROHIBITIVE TO TRY TO ALTER THAT. SO TO PUT OTHER MATERIALS TO THAT, TO TRY AND FANE ADDITIONAL GLASS, I THINK WOULD END UP JUST LOOKING LIKE WE TRIED TO FANE GLASS. AND I THINK EMBRACING THE BRICK, EMBRACING THE TRADITIONAL MATERIAL OF THAT, ALLOWING THE WINDOWS THAT WE DO HAVE TO BECOME AS LARGE AS THEY PHYSICALLY CAN WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THAT STRUCTURE, BRINGING THEM LOWER TO THE GROUND SO THEY BECOME MORE APPARENT FROM THE STREET, HAS LED US IN THE DIRECTION OF THE INTENT OF THIS WITH, WITH, I THINK, GOOD SUCCESS. AND I THINK, AGAIN, THIS IS WHY WE DON'T MEET THE ACTUAL NUMBER OF 75%. I THINK WE'VE MET THE INTENT. WELL, VERY WELL. AND I THINK WE HAVE A POSITIVE INFLUENCE FROM THAT. THIS IS THE FACADE OF THE OF THE THEATER FACING THE STREET. ONCE AGAIN, ONE OF THOSE AREAS IN WHICH ADDING WINDOWS REALLY IS, IS JUST IT'S COUNTERINTUITIVE TO THE FUNCTION OF THE SPACE, OF COURSE. SO THAT COUNTS AWAY FROM OUR AVERAGE 75% TO A FACADE, CONSIDERABLY. SPEAKING BRIEFLY BEFORE I LEAVE THIS BUILDING, SPEAKING BRIEFLY ABOUT THE SIGNS, I'M GOING TO GO BACK UP TO SHEET TWO OF 11. AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE AT THE THIRD ELEVATION DOWN ON THE SHEET, YOU CAN SEE SOME DASHED LINES FOR WHERE THE SIGNS ARE NOTED. SO WHAT WE'VE DONE IS WE'VE CREATED A RECESS INTO THAT FACADE TO GIVE A SORT OF BACKDROP FOR IT, AND THEN WE'RE CREATING AN ACTUAL BACKDROP OR A BACK PLATE TO EACH SIGN. SO THE SIGNS, WHILE WE'RE WHILE WE'RE PROPOSING TO ALLOW THEM TO HAVE THEIR OWN FONT AND THEIR OWN COLOR, EVEN THEIR LOGOS, WE'RE TRYING TO GIVE A UNIFYING NATURE TO THOSE SIGNS BY ALL HAVING THE SAME BASIC WHITE BACKGROUND THAT THEY'RE SET UPON, SO YOU CAN RECOGNIZE EACH OF THESE ELEMENTS, AND IT BRINGS SOME ORDER TO THE TO THE SIGNS AND SOME CONSISTENCY BETWEEN ALL THE BUILDINGS, THAT THESE SIGNS WOULD HAVE THAT SAME BACKDROP.

BUT WE FEEL LIKE THE OVERALL SIZE OF THISACILIT F THE WY,TH THEF THE, OHE TARKING P ARE A,THINK I 'SITMPORTA I THAT NTR SAFY PURPETE, IFOS ERY IGN IS S THE ECT SAMXA THENCO, SA FONT,MEAME SIZE, S OU HAV YE TO TUALLYAC RD THATY TO FI THE SNDRYTO OU'RE YEKING SEDAN WHILE YORE TRYU'G TOIN NIGATE AV ARKING PATLO OF TH SIZE,ISND A FR A DISOMNCE, YTA'REOU GOINGI TOIT MUCSAFER H BETOBLE A DENTIF IAY LOG A COMO,NY , EVENHE STY TLE OF E PARTE LTERINGETS OFTE IN F OHE LOG TO OF OF AA STE'S IDORTITY, END MANYAN OPLE HPEE ALREAVY SEEADN TS, ONLI BR Y VISITG ITIN ORNE HINGAV GOTN A MATEER HATEVE WIT IS.R O S I TNK AS L OF SAOTTY INFE A OF THTYIS SE THATIZS BY HANG IT VICHMUASIER E TOIND TH FE SIGFROM TN T CE ANDE ABLE BO TAVIGAT N E A PARTONGKI SPA THAT'CE SOSEST CLTO THA THATT.TORE. SSO IS IS THY WE'RWHE PPOSINGROO ETH TENAN TO HATS THEIRVE OWIDENTIN WITHITYTHEIRN SIGNS .TBU TO A A UNIDDING BAFYCK PTE IT, AM GOG TOINWITCH S MENT TMOONOTHER AXHIBIT E .M GOINI'G TO OWSHOU THI Y SNDERINREANDG THIS RDERINGEN SHS YOU OWETH ELEVAONS THTI I JT DEMOUSTRATINNSG, BUT INLOR,CO IA MOREN F O A PHIC IRAGE WITMAH A

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[00:45:02]

THENDO A'LN OVERL ON THAY. ANDAT HE OFF TE ISIC USEUP OND SAMEUER LEVPPS WITHELGAIN A THE DETARE F THES.AME CO SICERN DETA TILHE SAMPANELE ING ANILTHE WAD Y WE'LLET SNS. ANIGSOD ORTH. F PORTTH TT IS THAHE EENT OFXTHIST NIO OF THE PSENTATREN, AMIO I RRECT?CO IS THE ANYTERNG QUESI MIHAED ASS COUE OFPL VARI ITIENTION M THEED CEAN REGARNG WINDIWS THADO TEAR SMALL THAN ER%. THE75Y ND MENTNED. YLI. AS IESS I A NED, TIOHE BRICKHAT IS T ADCENTJA TTHOSE O IS EXISTG. OOKING L TDO OVEO AY ONRL NATUBUTHTHERE'T AS STRUCRALTU TO ITRE, IHINK T TSTARTO JUSTAD APPLIÉS ON QUERE WOTHDUL TART L SKING ROOHERAT FAKE. WE'VTIS BRICKNG. IHINK T MUCHTHINKE'VE A WIEVEDCH AS S WE A RSONABLEACAN INY HE T NTEXT CO OUROFXISTIN E GNDITIOCONS TO INCREASE OUR GLAS AREA, ALBEIT NOT TO THE FULL 75% AND TO THE IMAGE OF THAT. I HAVE NO FURTHER QUESTIONS. MR. ADLER.

HE'S AVAILABLE FOR QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD OR YOUR STAFF. CAN WE GO BACK TO SOME OF THESE THINGS? THERE'S SOME REALLY SOME THINGS THAT I THINK ARE VISUALLY WEIRD, IF YOU WOULDN'T, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM. CAN YOU GO BACK TO THE FIRST ONES, THE FIRST BUILDING? JUST GO BACK TO THE FIRST BUILDING. YOU BET. THERE JUST SEEMS TO BE KIND OF THE PIECES THAT LOOK LIKE THEY'RE GOING NOWHERE. BUT. SO THIS WILL BE ENLARGED ONE. I THINK EITHER EITHER IT'S FINE, BUT SO LIKE THE SECOND AFTER THE CINEMA THERE IT LOOKS LIKE IT DIPS DOWN. IT SEEMS LIKE THE HEIGHTS ARE A LITTLE WONKY IN SOME PLACES. YEAH. JUST VISUALLY THIS ONE SEEMS OKAY. I THINK IF YOU GO TO THE, THE BIGGER VERSION, I THINK THE ISSUE ON THE BIGGER VERSION IS YOU'VE GOT TOO MANY WINDOWS IN CERTAIN PLACES. I HAVE TO APOLOGIZE. I'M HAVING A HARD TIME HEARING YOU.

SO IF YOU GO TO THE BIGGER VERSION, YES. YEAH. SO THERE'S THREE WINDOWS AND THEN THERE'S FOUR WINDOWS RIGHT. WHAT'S THE IS THERE A REASON THERE'S SOME OF THE BUILDINGS HAVE THREE, SOME HAVE YOU KNOW FOUR. THESE ARE NOT WINDOWS BUT LIKE THEY'RE STACKED. ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE GRID WITHIN THE WINDOWS. YEAH WE'VE WE'VE I THINK WE'VE REALLY TRIED TO CREATE GRIDS THAT ARE PROPORTIONAL TO EACH OF THE SEGMENTS. IT'S ALSO A MATTER OF BEING ABLE TO DIVIDE THEM EVENLY. AND EITHER IN SOME CASES WE HAVE TO GO WITH EITHER A LARGER OR SMALLER PANE, CERTAINLY AMENABLE TO ADJUSTMENT. IF THE BOARD SO DICTATES THAT WE SHOULD DO SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY. BUT THEY'RE ALL, IN EACH CASE TRYING TO FIT PROPORTIONATELY TO THE GENERAL AREA. OKAY. SO IF WE LOOK AT THE BOTTOM PICTURE THERE, SO WE HAVE

[00:50:07]

[00:55:01]

AND THESE THESE SIDE FACADES ARE GOING TO BE ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BUILDING, RIGHT? WE COME UP ON THIS SIDE, BUT THEN THERE'S PARKING AND WHATNOT ON THE OTHER SIDE, RIGHT? YES. ACTUALLY. SO THIS FACADE RIGHT HERE IS THE ONE THAT'S FACING THE STREET. THIS IS THE ONE THAT'S UP AT THE OTHER END OF THIS BUILDING, A WHERE AS YOU WOULD GO AROUND THAT YOU WOULD GO OFF TO THOSE APARTMENTS THAT ARE UP THERE. AND SO THIS IS WHAT THE APARTMENTS WOULD SEE. ONCE AGAIN, WE'RE TAKING THE END FEATURE ON THE FRONT FACADE AND HAVING IT TURN THE CORNER. AND THEN WE'RE PULLING A FASCIA ACROSS THE TOP AND THEN WE'RE MIMICKING THAT TO THE BACK. AND HAVING THIS BRICK IN BETWEEN. SO THERE'S MATERIALS THAT ARE SIMILAR TO THE FRONT FACADE THAT ARE, THAT ARE WELL FINISHED AND DETAILED. IT'S NOT JUST A CONCRETE BLOCK FACE, OKAY. IT LOOKS PRETTY BLANK STILL. PARDON ME. IT STILL LOOKS PRETTY BLANK. WELL, IT'S NOT ONE THAT I CAN REALLY ADD WINDOWS. I GET THAT. YEAH. I PERSONALLY WOULD ADD TRELLISES WITH NATIVE VINES ON THEM. YEAH. BUT SURELY YOU COULD FIND SOMETHING. AND WE COULD CERTAINLY ADD MORE ARTICULATION TO THE FACADE. WHY NOT TRELLISES WITH NATIVE VINES? WELL, I THINK IT'S A MAINTENANCE ISSUE. RIGHT.

WELL, IT DEPENDS ON THE VINE. SOME SOME VINES REALLY DESTROY WHAT THEY GROW ON AND SOME DON'T. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT VIRGINIA CREEPER DOESN'T HURT BUILDINGS. AND THERE'S WHAT IS THERE AN EVERGREEN NATIVE HONEYSUCKLE WITH THE BEAUTIFUL FLOWERS THAT JUST TWINES AROUND THE TRELLIS RATHER THAN SINKING ROOTS INTO IT? I'M LOOKING. OR I HAVE A QUESTION. IS THERE AVAILABLE PLANTING SPACE IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING? PERHAPS SOME FLOWERING TREES OR SOME SOMETHING OF SCALE THAT REPEATS AND BREAKS UP THE FACADE IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING WOULD HAVE A BIG IMPACT ON THAT. BREAKING UP THAT BLANK FACADE. YEAH, THAT WOULD THAT WOULD BREAK IT UP.

FLOWERING TREES SOUND REALLY GOOD. I'LL BE HONEST. SOME PLANTERS, AT THE VERY LEAST TALL PLANTERS. I'M GOING TO HAVE TO GIVE US SOMETHING. I KNOW YOU DIDN'T COME WITH SOME LANDSCAPING, BUT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU WANT SOME VARIANCES, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GIVE US SOME LANDSCAPING. I WOULD SAY. I BELIEVE THAT'S ALL CONCRETE AT THIS POINT. CAN YOU CAN YOU SCROLL DOWN TO TESTIFY THAT IT IS. BUT I BELIEVE IT MIGHT BE I THINK SPECIFICALLY AT THE ENTRANCE MORE THAN AT THE BACK. IF YOU COULD SCROLL DOWN AND SEE HOW MUCH SPACER IS THERE ON THE ON THE FIRST PAGE. IF IT'S NOT TREES, YOU CAN DEFINITELY GET IN SOME PLANTERS, RIGHT? I MEAN, WE COULD GET PLANTERS FOR THAT. SURE. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. SO WHICH FACADE ARE WE TALKING ABOUT?

[01:00:03]

IT'S THIS FACADE HERE, TOO, IS RELATIVELY AN INVISIBLE FACADE. I DEFINITELY UNDERSTAND HERE THIS FACES THESE APARTMENTS. I THINK THAT HAS A LOT MORE SENSE. AND THIS FACES THE STREET. AND WHAT ABOUT BUILDING C WHERE IT FACES THE STREET? THE HIGHWAY FACING THE STREET ON BUILDING C AS WELL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, SO THOSE KINDS OF FACADES MAYBE ARE MORE REASONABLE TO HAVE SOME ADDITIONAL FEATURE LIKE THAT PERHAPS. OKAY. I NEED TO SPEAK TO ANOTHER EXPERT TO DETERMINE EXACTLY WHAT THAT IS. SO I DON'T WANT TO MAKE A COMMITMENT TO WHAT THAT IS MYSELF. BUT. OKAY.

GREAT. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I GUESS WE'RE GOOD. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NO. OKAY. OH, YEAH.

THE SHOPRITE LOGO. THE ROUND, THE CIRCULAR ONE. YES. THAT I KNOW THEY YOU EVERYTHING HAS SPACE AND THAT ONE DOESN'T HAVE SPACE. DOES THAT. YOU SEE WHEN IT'S LIKE JAMMED RIGHT UP AT THE TOP THAT CIRCLE WHEN YOU SAY HAS SPACE, YOU MEAN OVER THE TOP. YEAH. NOT IN THAT PICTURE. THE ONE ANOTHER ONE OF THE OTHER PICTURES. YEAH. GO TO THE COLOR PICTURE. I THINK IN THE SMALLER SCALE THEY START TO MUDDY UP A LITTLE BIT. BUT YOU CAN SEE HERE THE KIND OF SPACE THERE'S A DECENT AMOUNT OF SEPARATION FROM THE FEATURE TO THE SIGN FOR SURE. YEAH. WE WOULDN'T WANT IT TO TOUCH OR GET CROWDED. SO THE SMALLER THE WHEN IT'S THE OTHER PICTURES WHERE IT'S. YEAH. WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT, I, I DEFINITELY UNDERSTAND THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT FROM THIS VANTAGE IT STARTS LOOKING A LITTLE JAMMED IN THER. BUT. OKAY. BUT IT'S OKAY. YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. I THINK WE'RE GOOD. YEAH. YEAH, YEAH. PROFESSIONALS. YEAH. I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY HAS QUESTIONS.

I'LL JUST SWEAR IN OUR PROFESSIONALS NOW IF THEY HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR TESTIMONY.

GENTLEMEN, YOU ALL SWEAR FROM YOUR TESTIMONY THIS EVENING WILL BE TRUTHFUL. THANK YOU. OKAY, MR. SULLIVAN, YOU WANT TO GO FIRST? I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY COMMENTS. MOST OF THE ITERATIONS OF THIS BUILDING WERE WORKED THROUGH THE SITE PLAN REVIEW COMMITTEE TO GET TO THIS POINT,

[01:05:02]

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AND THE UNIFORMITY IS NOT SO GREAT WHERE THE WHERE THE HIGHER LIGHTING LEVELS ARE, ARE REALLY IN THE SIDEWALK AREAS. AND WHEN WE DISCUSSED THIS AT THE SITE PLAN COMMITTEE, EVEN THOUGH RELIEF IS NECESSARY, WE FELT IT WAS REASONABLE TO HAVE HIGHER LIGHTING LEVELS BECAUSE THERE CANNOT BE RECESSED LIGHTS, AND THAT TO MAKE IT A SAFER ENVIRONMENT THAT YOU CAN HAVE BRIGHTER LIGHTS UNDER THERE, PROVIDED THAT THEY DIDN'T INTERFERE WITH THE VEHICULAR TRAVEL WAYS. IN TERMS OF CREATING A REAL OFF OUT OF BALANCE SITUATION. AND NONE OF IT IS NEAR THE HOUSING. NO, NO, THERE ARE LIGHTS THAT FACE THE NEW, THAT FACE THE NEW APARTMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN CONSTRUCTED, THAT ALL GO ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE TO THE HIGHWAY.

AND ALSO ON THE REAR THERE ARE NEW LIGHTS THERE. THOSE ARE POLE MOUNTED LIGHTS. SO THOSE ARE LED REPLACEMENTS AND THEY SHOULD HAVE LESS GLARE THAN THE LIGHTS THAT WERE THERE PREVIOUSLY.

OKAY. SO THOSE THREE LIGHTS ALREADY EXIST AND THEY'RE JUST BEING SWAPPED OUT TO LEDS, THOSE ONES IN THE BACK. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? I MEAN YOU CAN HAVE YOUR WE HAVE OUR LIGHTING CONSULTANT HERE WHO CAN TALK ABOUT THE LIGHTING IF YOU WANT. OKAY. DO YOU. YES. YOU CAN ALSO TRY TO DO SOMETHING WE CAN WORK OUT FOR HELP, MAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS. MAYBE WE SOMETHING THAT COULD BE ACHIEVED AND ALSO, YOU SAID REPLACING THE DEAD TREES BETWEEN THE EXISTING DEAD TREES AND THERE ARE MORE TREES ARE PLANTED IN THE ORIGINAL DESIGN. GO BACK SEVERAL YEARS AND THEY SHOULD BE REPLACED. YES. APPROVAL? YES. YEAH. THE ONE PROBLEM WITH THE TREES WE HAVE VERY SMALL ISLANDS. WE HAVE. THERE'S NO IRRIGATION. IT'S VERY DIFFICULT FOR THOSE TREES TO SURVIVE. AND I MEAN, WE CAN REPLACE IF THERE ARE DEAD TREES TODAY, WE'LL REPLACE THEM.

[01:10:02]

SOMETHING MAYBE MORE. ALL RIGHT. WELL, I GUESS WE'LL, YOU KNOW, WE'LL WE'LL WE'LL LOOK INTO THAT. BUT WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? YOU'LL LOOK INTO THAT? I MEAN, I THINK YEAH. WELL, I GUESS I NEED TO KNOW THE DETAILS. ROBERT, WHAT ARE YOU TELLING ME? HOW MANY TREES ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? WHATEVER WAS APPROVED ORIGINALLY FOR THE FOR THE SUMMER. RIGHT. THAT'S ALL. YEAH. NOTHING MORE.

AND YOU KNOW WHAT ELSE THERE USED TO BE? GROVES OF WHITE PINES AND THORNLESS HONEY LOCUSTS ALONG THE HIGHWAY, WHICH ARE MANY OF THEM ARE STILL THERE, BUT MANY WERE REMOVED BECAUSE I THINK OF SEWER WORK UNDERGROUND PIPES BEING PUT IN SO THAT THEY COULDN'T STAY, AND ALL THE MORE REASON TO HAVE MORE TREES ON SITE THAN YOU HAVE WORK BY ELSEWHERE ON THE SHOPPING CENTER OR BY THE TOWN. THEY ARE NOW GONE, IS THE POINT. WELL, AGAIN, IF WE DIDN'T REMOVE THEM, THAT BUT YOU NEED MORE TREES. IF THIS WAS A NEW APPLICATION, YOU'D HAVE TO PLANT A LOT OF TREES AND YOU'D HAVE TO HAVE A LOT OF GREEN SPACE TO PLANT THE TREES IN ALL THE TREES REPLACE ALL WE'RE ASKING IS FOR MORE TREES IN THE GREEN SPACES THAT YOU DO HAVE. IN THE IN THE PLANTABLE SPACES THAT YOU DO HAVE, IT'S A NATIVE TREES. I'M SURE MR. BARTOLONE IS VERY REASONABLE. EVERYBODY GETS ALONG WITH MR. VARGAS. WE GET ALONG VERY WELL. I DO. I WAS RECENTLY CALLED TO A HOUSE BY A HOMEOWNER WHO NEEDED ADVICE ON HER TREE. AND SHE SAID SOMEBODY CAME POINTING OUT THAT IT'S BEEN REALLY DIFFICULT TO MAINTAIN THE LANDSCAPING OUT THERE, BUT MAYB, MR. BARLOW, I THINK YOU CAN FIGURE SOMETHING OUT. SUGGESTIONS ON HAVE A HAVE A MEETING, HAVE A MEETING AND SEE WHAT CAN BE DONE. I WANT TO ON MY END. I DO LIKE THE DESIGN.

I'LL BE HONEST. I THINK UPDATING MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. I KNOW THERE MAY BE PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT HAPPY WITH IT, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE IS A NEW SHOPPING CENTER COMING ACROSS THE STREET FROM YOU ALMOST ACROSS THE STREET, AND IT MAKES SENSE FOR A BUSINESS. AND WE ARE HERE TO SUPPORT OUR BUSINESSES. SO THE DESIGN, THE WINDOWS, THE GLASS, I THINK IT'S A PLUS FOR US RESIDENTS. SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. I AGREE IT JUST NEEDS A LOT MORE TREES. YEAH.

THE ONES, THE EXISTING ONES THAT WERE THERE ORIGINALLY NEED TO BE PUT BACK. OTHERWISE THE EXTENT POSSIBLE. AND YOU KNOW I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT WHEN WE GO TO BUILDING C THAT'S WHY I ASKED THAT QUESTION. IT'S PROBABLY NOT MUCH WE CAN DO, BUT CERTAINLY ON BUILDING A SITE, I THINK WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. AND IN THE FRONT. HERE WHAT YOU SAID, JUST TRYING TO WORK TOGETHER WITH THEM, TOGETHER WITH THEM TO COME UP WITH. YEAH, I GUESS YOU CAN TELL ME. DO YOU WANT TO HEAR FROM OUR ON LIGHTING? YES. OKAY. MR. LATTES, JUST A QUICK QUESTION.

YES. THE COLORIZED RENDERING THAT WE WERE LOOKING AT THE FACADE OF THE MONTGOMERY CINEMA, IS THAT A SEPARATE EXHIBIT? IS THAT A4? YEAH. THAT'S A4, IT'S OKAY. GREAT. THANK YOU. SO I CALL CHRIS GARRITY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. IT'S MR. GARY, IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. ALL RIGHT. YEAH. WE'LL JUST SWEAR YOU IN. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM YOUR TESTIMONY? THIS EVENING WILL BE TRUTHFUL. I DO, THANK YOU. SECURITY, PLEASE PROVIDE YOUR FULL NAME AND BUSINESS ADDRESS. FOR THE RECORD, PLEASE. CHRIS GARRITY, RJS ASSOCIATES, 41 LEPPARD ROAD, PAOLI, PENNSYLVANIA. OKAY, CAN YOU SPELL YOUR LAST NAME, PLEASE? G A R R I T Y THANK YOU, MR. CARTER. CAN YOU PROVIDE A BRIEF SUMMARY OF YOUR EDUCATIONAL AND PROFESSIONAL BACKGROUND, PLEASE? SURE. I

[01:15:02]

I'VE BEEN IN PENNSYLVANIA FOR APPROXIMATELY 25 YEARS. SINCE THEN. RECEIVED MY LICENSE FOR IN PENNSYLVANIA, ALSO NEW JERSEY AND DELAWARE. APPROXIMATELY 18 YEARS AGO. ALSO WORKED EXTENSIVELY WITHIN THE LAST 15 YEARS, NOT ONLY ON LANDSCAPE PROJECTS, BUT BUT LIGHTING PROJECTS AS WELL. LIGHTING PROJECTS FOR MEDICAL CAMPUSES, FOR RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENTS, FOR TOWN CENTERS, RETAIL AND COMMERCIAL PROJECTS SIMILAR TO THIS. SO YOU HAVE DESIGNED LIGHTING APPLICATIONS FOR VARIOUS TYPES OF PROJECTS SIMILAR TO THE ONE THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING TONIGHT. YES I HAVE. OKAY. I OFFER MR. KOLODY AS AN EXPERT IN LIGHTING AND LANDSCAPING. HE'S ALSO A LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT. THANK YOU. SO I THINK YOU HAVE A FEW EXHIBITS WE'RE GOING TO GO THROUGH. YES, I CAN GO THROUGH THOSE IF YOU LIKE. I COULD ADDRESS SOME OF THE ONE OF THE QUESTIONS RELATED TO THE LANDSCAPING ALONG THE CINEMA. I THINK IT WAS THAT WE CAN LOOK AT THE AERIAL. THERE IS A LAMP OR A GREEN SPACE ON THAT ELEVATION OF THAT CINEMA BUILDING THAT YOU VIEW FROM 206. IT LAST TIME I WAS AT THE SITE, THERE WERE RECENTLY, I THINK IT'S TWO OR MAYBE THREE TREES THAT WERE INSTALLED THERE. I DON'T KNOW IF THEY'RE ORNAMENTAL OR SHADE TREES, BUT THERE ARE TREES THAT WOULD KIND OF SCREEN AND BUFFER THAT ELEVATION THAT YOU GUYS WERE DISCUSSING EARLIER. ALSO TO NOTE, WHEN I GET INTO THE LIGHTING REVIEW ALONG THAT SIDEWALK, THERE WILL BE TWO 14 FOOT HIGH ORNAMENTAL PEDESTRIAN SCALE LIGHTS THAT CAN, I THINK, ALSO ADD TO SOME OF THE SOFTENING OF THAT ELEVATION. SO YOU'RE GOING TO BE REFERRING TO, I BELIEVE, A PLANT SET THAT YOUR OFFICE PREPARED AND FILED AS PART OF THIS APPLICATION IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. YEAH. THERE'S FIVE SHEETS IN THIS PLAN SET. SO WE'LL CALL THIS A FIVE LIGHTING PLANS OKAY. EXCUSE ME BEFORE I TRY TO MAKE SOME SENSE OF A LOT OF THE DOTS AND OVALS AND LINES THAT YOU SEE ON THIS LIGHTING PLAN, I JUST WANT TO REMIND EVERYONE SOME OF THE COMMENTS BEFORE THAT, ALL OF ALL OF THE LIGHTS ON THIS SITE WILL BE NEW. THERE'LL BE LED LIGHTS THERE, MORE ENERGY EFFICIENT. THEY'RE ALL CUT OFF FIXTURES WHICH LEAD TO DARK SKY COMPLIANCE. SO THAT'S SOMETHING TO KEEP IN MIND AS WE WALK THROUGH. WHAT I'LL START WITH. IS THERE ESSENTIALLY FIVE DIFFERENT TYPES OF LIGHTS ON THE SITE? THE FIRST ONES ARE THE RECESSED LIGHTS THAT WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT. THOSE ARE ALONG THE FRONTAGE TO BUILDING A ALONG THE FRONTAGE OF BUILDING B. THOSE ARE THESE LITTLE TINY CIRCLES THAT YOU SEE HERE ALONG THE FRONTAGE HERE. AND ALSO ALONG THE FRONTAGE OF BUILDING C. AND THOSE WOULD BE LOCATED UP UNDERNEATH THE CANOPIES AND SHINING DOWN ONTO THE WALKWAYS IN FRONT OF THE DOORS AND THE WINDOWS OF THE STOREFRONTS. SOME OF THESE LARGER CIRCLES HERE, THOSE ARE THE SUSPENDED LIGHTS THAT HANG DOWN. IT'S MORE OF A DOWNROD, AND THOSE WOULD BE KIND OF IN THE, I GUESS, THE ATRIUM SPACE OF THAT SHOPRITE, BUT ESSENTIALLY THE SAME WORKING IN THE SAME WAY. IT'S A RECESSED DOWN LIGHT. THE THIRD TYPE OF LIGHT IS AROUND BUILDING D, WHICH IS A WALL MOUNTED LIGHT. ALL THOSE WALL MOUNTED LIGHTS WOULD BE DOWN LIGHTS ONLY. THERE WOULD NOT BE ANY LIGHT GOING UP AGAIN. IT'S SHOWN WITH THE SMALLER CIRCLES YOU SEE SURROUNDING THE BUILDING. THEY'D BE LOCATED PRIMARILY ON THE COLUMNS AND PIERS AROUND THE BUILDING. SO MOVING ON. THE FOURTH TYPE OF LIGHT IS THE PARKING AREA, SITE LIGHTS, AND THOSE ARE 20 FOOT HIGH. THEY'D BE NEW FIXTURES ON NEW STEEL POLES WITH A NEW FOOTING, ESSENTIALLY LOCATED RIGHT NEXT TO THE EXISTING FOOTING THAT'S OUT THERE. NOW. SO BASICALLY WHAT WE'VE DONE IS GONE AND MODELED THE NEW LED TO SHOW THE LIGHTING LEVELS IN THE PARKING LOT. AFTER WE DID THAT, WE FOUND THAT THERE WERE SOME DARK AREAS THAT WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO IMPROVE THE LIGHTING A LITTLE BIT. SO WE ACTUALLY ADDED THIS LIGHT RIGHT HERE WHERE THE ARROW PART THOUGH

[01:20:01]

MOVING TO THE FIFTH TYPE OF LIGHT IS WHAT WE'VE GONE IN AND DONE IS ADDED SOME OF THOSE ORNAMENTAL PEDESTRIAN SCALE LIGHTING. THOSE ARE ON A 14 FOOT POLE, AND THERE'S TWO OF THEM.

AS I MENTIONED EARLIER IN FRONT OF THE THAT I GUESS THE ELEVATION OF BUILDING A THAT FACES 206, THOSE WOULD BE 14 FOOT HIGH PEDESTRIAN SCALE LIGHTS. THEY LIGHT THE SIDEWALK THAT COMES FROM THE APARTMENT NEXT DOOR. WE'VE ALSO ADDED TWO LIGHTS IN THIS SPACE HERE TO ILLUMINATE THAT AREA. IT'S KIND OF DARK RIGHT NOW, AND WE ALSO ADDED ANOTHER PEDESTRIAN LIGHT TO BE RIGHT IN THE SIDEWALKS WHERE PEOPLE ARE ENTERING AND EXITING OUT OF THE BUILDINGS.

AND THERE WAS A SIXTH NEW LIGHT THAT'S NOT OUT THERE. NOW, THAT WOULD ALSO BE A PEDESTRIAN SCALE LIGHT IN THAT AREA. ONE THING BEFORE I JUST GO THROUGH SOME OF THE ENLARGEMENTS TO SHOW SOME OF THESE AREAS A LITTLE BIT BETTER, BUT WHAT WE DID WAS MODELED. ALL THESE LIGHTS ARE 3000 K. IT FELT LIKE THAT'S A GOOD IT'S A NICE KIND OF MEET IN THE MIDDLE LIGHT. IT'S NOT TOO BLUE. IT'S NOT TOO ORANGE AND YELLOW. BUT ALL THE LIGHTS WOULD HAVE THAT SAME 3000 KELVIN APPEARANCE TO THEM. MOVING ON TO SHEET TWO, THIS IS JUST AN ENLARGEMENT. WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS YOU'RE LOOKING DOWN ON BUILDING A. HERE'S THE STOREFRONT HERE. AND THESE BLACK SQUARES ARE THE COLUMNS THAT ROBERT WAS DISCUSSING EARLIER. AND THEN WHAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE, THIS IS A BLOW UP OF WHAT THAT RECESSED LIGHT WOULD LOOK LIKE UP ABOVE YOU IN THE CANOPY ABOVE, ROUGHLY LOCATED 15 FOOT ON CENTER, KIND OF IN BETWEEN THE TWO COLUMNS. THAT'S WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE SOME HIGHER LIGHT LEVELS AS WELL. AND BASED ON IESNA STANDARDS, TRY TO HAVE A HIGHER LIGHT LEVEL CLOSER TO FIVE FOOT CANDLES THAT STOREFRONTS AND BUILDING ENTRANCES. SO THAT'S WHERE YOU'RE SEEING SOME OF THE HIGHER LIGHT LEVELS AS WELL. SIMILAR LIGHTS HERE. THIS IS THE I GUESS, THE NORTH SIDE OF BUILDING B, SO THE SAME RECESSED LIGHTS HAPPENING THERE. THESE ARE THE SUSPENDED LIGHTS THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT EARLIER. THAT WOULD BE ON A TYPE OF WHOOPS DOWNROD. IN THE ATRIUM AREA, THE CANOPY AREA OF THE SHOP, RIGHT. AND THEN AS YOU WORK TOWARDS THE

[01:25:07]

THE LIGHT SOURCE IN THIS IS IN THE TOP, SO IT SHINES DOWN JUST LIKE THE PARKING LOT LIGHTS DO.

AND THAT WOULD BE AT A 14 FOOT HIGH MOUNTING HEIGHT. THIS IS JUST A BLOW UP OF WHAT THE PARKING LOT FIXTURE WOULD LOOK LIKE UP CLOSER. SAME WITH THE PEDESTRIAN LIGHT. AND THEN WE HAD SOME IMAGES. I THINK EVERYONE'S FAMILIAR WITH A RECESSED LIGHT. THIS WOULD BE THE WALL MOUNTED LIGHT ON BUILDING D, AND THIS IS THE SUSPENDED LIGHT. THAT WOULD BE OUT IN FRONT OF THE SHOP RIGHT. THE LAST SHEET WAS A CONCEPTUAL LIGHTING CONTROL DIAGRAM. WE'RE NOT MEPS, SO WE WOULDN'T GET THE SPECIFICS OF EXACTLY HOW THEY'RE CONTROLLED. BUT WE WANTED TO IMPLY WHAT OUR THOUGHTS WERE AS FAR AS WHEN LIGHTS WOULD BE ON AND WHEN LIGHTS WOULD BE OFF.

AND WHAT WE'VE SHOWN IS ALL THE RED SQUARES ARE ON A LIGHT FIXTURE. THAT WOULD BE ON THROUGHOUT THE NIGHT. THAT'S IF YOU IF YOU LOOK AT IT, IT'S BASICALLY FOLLOWING THE ENTRANCE ROAD ALONG THE FRONT EDGES TO THESE, TO THE STOREFRONTS ON THE FRONT OF SHOPRITE AS YOU GO BACK AROUND AND THEN THE FRONTAGE OR THE STOREFRONTS OF BUILDING C, AND THEN AND THEN BACK OUT AGAI.

THE LIGHTING FOR APARTMENTS WOULD ALSO BE ON ALL NIGHT FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY REASONS.

REALLY, THE BLUE TRIANGLES REPRESENT FIXTURES THAT AFTER 11:00 AT NIGHT, THEY WOULD DROP TO 50% ILLUMINATION AND THEN THEY WOULD BE ON A MOTION SENSORS. AND THE GREEN LIGHTS ARE LIGHTS THAT WOULD GO OFF AT 11:00. SO RIGHT NOW AT THE AT THE, AT THE SENIOR HOUSING, DO THE LIGHTS STAY ON ALL THE TIME, ALL FULL LEVEL. I MEAN, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT WOULD BE A GOOD PLACE TO ALSO BE AT 50%. WOULD THAT NOT PROVIDE SAFETY AND SECURITY? BUT ALSO, YOU KNOW, NOT HAVE BRIGHT LIGHTS IN THEIR WINDOWS? I'M NOT SURE OF THE OPERATING HOURS OF THE LIGHTS AT THE EXISTING LIGHTS AT THE APARTMENT RIGHT NOW. BUT WHAT WOULD BE TYPICAL OF OTHER APARTMENTS DO, DO THOSE TYPES OF LIGHTS STAY ON ALL NIGHT AT APARTMENT COMPLEXES? USUALLY IT IT VARIES BASED ON DIFFERENT PROJECTS I'VE WORKED ON. SOME OF THEM CAN CAN WORK WHERE THEY GET DIMMED PARTIALLY, BUT IF IT'S MORE OF A DESIRE REALLY OF THE OWNER, IF IT'S A SECURITY AND SAFETY ISSUE, I THINK MAYBE, PERHAPS WITH THIS BEING A DEAD END STREET WOULD BE DARKER BACK THERE THAT THEY HAVE A DESIRE TO HAVE THOSE BE ON ALL NIGHT. LIKE THE CURRENT ONE IS ON A 50%

[01:30:11]

THEY'RE. YEAH. EXACTLY. RIGHT HERE. YEAH. SO IF THE CURRENT ONES ARE GO DOWN IN INTENSITY TO 50% AFTER 11:00 PM, CAN WE MAINTAIN IT IN THE SAME THRESHOLD? I DON'T THINK THEY GO DOWN TO 50% TODAY. OKAY. MAYBE I THINK THE QUESTION SHOULD BE ASKED SINCE WE ARE JUST, YOU KNOW, REPLACING THE LIGHTS. WOULD YOU HAVE THEM AT THE SAME STANDARD THAT THEY WERE BEFORE THAT, THAT IS, I THINK, THE QUESTION THAT'S BEING ASKED. SO YOU'RE NOT CHANGING BUT YOU'RE DOING OKAY. SO I THINK THAT THAT ANSWERS EVERYBODY'S QUESTIONS. THANK YOU. ARE THERE REALLY NO LIGHTS? BUT ON THE LOADING DOCK BEHIND THE SHOP. RIGHT. THERE'S NOTHING DEPICTED ON EITHER DIAGRAM. THERE ARE A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT WALL PACKS AND DOWN LIGHTS AROUND AROUND THE BACK OF ALL A, B AND C, MOSTLY SECURITY LIGHTING. AT THIS POINT, WE REALLY FOCUS OTHER THAN THE THREE LIGHTS THAT ARE OVER BY THE ADJACENT APARTMENT BUILDINGS, REALLY FOCUSED ON THE STOREFRONTS AND THE PARKING. THE CENTRALIZED PARKING LOT. SO THOSE SECURITY LIGHTS WILL STILL REMAIN RIGHT BEHIND THOSE. THE LOADING DOCKS. YES. IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THOSE WILL NOT CHANGE. I HAVE A QUESTION FOR CLARIFICATION. IN MR. SULLIVAN'S MEMO. IT'S ON PAGE 18. HE MAKES A NOTE AND INDICATES THAT, UNLESS PERMITTED BY THE PLANNING OR ZONING BOARD, AS THE CASE MAY BE ILLUMINATED, SIGNAGE NEEDS TO BE TURNED OFF BY THE CLOSE OF BUSINESS, AS IDENTIFIED FOR THAT PARTICULAR BUSINESS, OR BY 11 P.M, WHICHEVER IS LATER. SO HE INDICATES THAT INFORMATION IS NOT ON THE PLAN. IS THAT INFORMATION THAT YOU'RE GOING TO PROVIDE TO THE BOARD ABOUT THE ILLUMINATED SIGNS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE SIGNAGE, RIGHT. NOW, THAT IS THE SIGN IN ILLUMINATION IS GOING OFF AT 11. I THINK THEY THEY DIMMED AT 11. I DON'T THINK THEY GO OFF. CORRECT. RIGHT. YOU'RE SAYING I'M NOT THE SIGNAGE SAYS WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER ONES? ABOUT THE 11. OKAY, OKAY. ALL SIGNAGE WILL GO OFF AT 11 EXCEPT SHOPRITE. THAT'S HOW IT IS TODAY. OKAY. SHOPRITE LIVES ON ITS OWN PLANET. MR. SULLIVAN, DO THEY NEED A VARIANCE? THEN? I'M NOT SURE WHAT THE WORD. ALL RIGHT. SO SHOPRITE STAYS ON ALL NIGHT, THEN? CORRECT THE SIGNS. YES. GOT IT. OKAY. SO MOST OF THE LIGHTS ARE GOING TO BE BRIGHTER THAN THEY ARE NOW. IS THAT RIGHT? YES. THEY'LL BE A LITTLE BIT BRIGHTER, BUT IT'LL BE A MORE EVEN DISTRIBUTION TO HAVE A MORE CONSISTENT LIGHT LEVEL ACROSS THE ENTIRE PARKING AREA.

RIGHT NOW, IF YOU'RE OUT THERE, THERE'S HOT SPOTS AND THERE'S VERY DARK SPOTS. I REALLY LIKE YOUR PARKING LOT THE WAY IT IS NOW. AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T HAVE YOUNG EYES. I HAVE OLD EYES. AND I STILL LIKE YOUR PARKING LOT THE WAY IT IS. IT'S. AND ALSO YOU SAID YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE IT VERY YELLOW. COULDN'T YOU HAVE THE LIGHTS YELLOWER BECAUSE IT'S BETTER FOR THE WILDLIFE. THE NOCTURNAL WILDLIF. I SUPPOSE THAT'S SOMETHING WE CONSIDER. I BELIEVE AFTER SOME DISCUSSION WITH SOME OF THE TOWNSHIP PLANNER, THAT THE 3000 LIGHT LEVEL WAS A LIGHT LEVEL

[01:35:03]

GOOD POINT. WELL, THEY I, I READ, I READ THAT POLLINATORS ARE DECLINING BY 1 TO 2% EVERY YEAR AT THAT RATE, PRETTY SOON SHOPRITE WON'T BE ABLE TO SELL ANY FRUITS OR VEGETABLES. YOU KNOW WHAT'S MORE IMPORTANT? SO YOU WANT IT AT 2700, PLEASE. I REPRESENT THE ENVIRONMENTAL COMMISSION ON THE PLANNING BOAR. THE 27,700. YEP. THANK YOU. TO DO THAT. THAT. YEP. COULD COULD YOU SCROLL DOWN. IS THERE I KNOW NOTE THAT YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING FOR THE SIDEWALKS ALONG 206. SO I'M JUST WONDERING IS THAT IS THAT ACTUALLY PART OF YOUR PROPERTY. LIKE WHAT'S THE CURRENT LIGHTING SITUATION FOR SIDEWALKS ALONG 206? WE'RE NOT PROPOSING ANY NEW FIXTURES ALONG 206. I BELIEVE THERE ARE SOME EXISTING COBRA HEADS ON SOME OF THE UTILITY POLES AT THE INTERSECTIONS. I BELIEVE THERE'S I THINK IT'S ON THIS CORNER. THERE'S ONE AND I THINK THERE IS ANOTHER LIGHT ON THIS CORNER. YEAH. WHICH ARE JUST ARMS MOUNTED TO SOME OF THE UTILITY POLES THAT ARE OUT THERE NOW, THERE IS A BUS STOP THERE THAT I THINK PEOPLE USE A LOT. I JUST DON'T KNOW, LIKE, DO WE HAVE ENOUGH? IS THERE ENOUGH LIGHT ALONG THERE? AND DID YOU EVALUATE THAT TO MAKE SURE WHAT'S THERE IS ADEQUATE? WE DID NOT LOOK AT THAT AREA. NO. I WOULD THINK IT I MEAN THAT IS PART OF YOUR PROPERTY THOUGH, RIGHT? OR NOT, I WOULD ASSUME.

WE DID LOOK AT SOME OF THE ADJOINING PROPERTIES IN OTHER AREAS. OTHER PROPERTIES IN THE AREA AND, AND FOUND THAT THOSE PROPERTIES DIDN'T, DIDN'T HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL LIGHTING ALONG THE FRONTAGE FOR THOSE PROPERTIES. OKAY. I JUST THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, I DO SEE A LOT OF PEOPLE USING THE BUS STOP THERE AND THE SIDEWALK ALONG THERE. I THINK IT'D BE ADVANTAGEOUS TO MAKE SURE, SINCE WE'RE REDESIGNING THIS, THAT THAT'S ASSESSED AND MAKE SURE THAT IT'S ADEQUATE. IS THERE A LIGHT IN THE BUS SHELTER? THAT MIGHT BE ADEQUATE? I'M NOT SURE.

BUT TO WALK ALONG, I THINK WE COULD TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. YEAH. OKAY, GREAT. WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. AS FAR AS THE LIGHTING AT THE EXISTING BUS SHELTER. SURE. GOOD. ANYTHING ELSE? ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF MR. GARRITY? NO, NO, NO. THANK YOU. YES, I HAVE A QUESTION, MR. SULLIVAN.

JUST A COUPLE. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE. ONE OF THE THINGS WE STRUGGLE WITH IS UNIFORMITY. AND JUST. AND I KNOW THAT YOU, YOUR CALCULATIONS REALLY REFLECT THE ENTIRETY OF THE OF THE PARKING LOT AREA, BUT YOU SEPARATED OUT THE WALKWAYS RIGHT. DO YOU THINK THE UNIFORMITY IN THE, IN THE PARKING LOT IS ACCEPTABLE AND SUFFICIENT FOR SAFETY SO THAT PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TWO DARK SPOTS OR TWO HOT SPOTS AS THEY'RE MOVING THROUGH AND THEY CAN SPOT PEDESTRIANS CROSSING AND THINGS LIKE THAT. YEAH, WE LOOKED AT ORIGINALLY, WE JUST DIDN'T ON THE DESIGN FOR THE RECESSED LIGHTING AND THE CANOPIES AND SAW THAT THOSE WERE HIGHER LIGHT LEVELS AND UPDATING THE LIGHTING

[01:40:01]

RIGHT. YEAH. THANK YOU. WELL, WE DO APPRECIATE THE SAFETY AND SECURITY PART OF THE LIGHTING. I THINK THAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT. AND WE HEAR THAT FROM OUR RESIDENTS EVERY DAY. SO THANK YOU. SURE. OKAY. I HAVE ONE MORE WITNESS WHO HAS A VERY SHORT PRESENTATION. IT'S RELATED TO THE EV PARKING AND THE NEW CROSSWALKS. AND THAT'LL BE IT OKAY. ALL RIGHT I CALL MR. ROBERT BOUCHARD. I'M SORRY, MR. BOUCHARD, DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM YOUR TESTIMONY THIS EVENING WILL BE TRUTHFUL. I DO, THANK YOU. PLEASE STATE YOUR FULL NAME AND BUSINESS ADDRESS, PLEASE. ROBERT BOUCHARD, 902 CARNEGIE CENTER, SUITE 400, PRINCETON, NEW JERSEY. MR. BOUCHARD, PLEASE PROVIDE BRIEFLY YOUR EDUCATIONAL PROFESSIONAL QUALIFICATIONS, PLEASE. I GRADUATED WITH A BS FROM RUTGERS IN 1973. I BECAME A PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER IN 1978, SO I HAVE 46 YEARS EXPERIENCE IN THE SITE ENGINEERING FIELD. I THINK I'VE TESTIFIED BEFORE THIS TOWNSHIP ZONING BOARD IN 12 YEARS AGO FOR THE SEATING AREAS FOR THIS PROPERTY. I OFFER MR. BOUCHARD AS AN EXPERT IN CIVIL ENGINEERING. OKAY, I ACCEPT IT. MR. BOUCHARD, I THINK YOU JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF EXHIBITS AGAIN, WHICH WERE PART OF THE APPLICATION SUBMISSION RELATED TO EV PARKING AND ON CROSSWALKS. RIGHT? RIGHT. I THINK I JUST FIND YOU. KNOW, I CAN'T FIND A SITE PLAN, BUT. HERE'S THE LIGHTING PLAN. THIS IS THE EV. CHARGES ARE GOING TO BE DOWN BY THE SANTANDER BANK. WE PUT FOUR PARKING SPACES, TWO DOUBLE EV CHARGING STATIONS THERE. AND WE WILL COMPLY WITH ALL THE SIGNAGE AND USAGE FEES REQUIREMENTS OF THE ORDINANCE FOR THOSE. THEY'RE GOING TO BE WELL LIT. THE LIGHTS UNDER THERE ARE GOING TO BE ON ALL NIGHT. THEY'RE DESIGNED TO BE ON ALL NIGHT. SO, YOU KNOW, IT ALSO HAS A GOOD VIEW FROM 206 SO PEOPLE CAN ACTUALLY SEE THEM WHEN THEY'RE DRIVING BY. AND HERE'S A BLOW UP OF THEM HERE. SO IT'S A CONVENIENT SPOT BECAUSE WE CAN DRAW THE ELECTRICITY RATE FROM THE ELECTRICAL ROOM FROM SANTANDER BANK BUILDING AND JUST BRING IT ACROSS. SO IT IS A CONVENIENT LOCATION. SO, MISS CASEY, I THINK THIS IS E 5 OR 6, SIX, 666. YEAH. SO THIS IS WHAT SHEET IS THIS EV THIS IS SHEET THREE OF THREE. I WOULD SAY THE SITE PLAN. YES I THINK I THINK IT WAS DONE. AND THEN THE CROSSWALK. I GUESS THIS ONE WE CAN SO WE THESE ARE THE NEW THE NEW RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITY TO THE NORTH OF THE SHOPPING CENTER. AND THESE HOPEFULLY THESE RESIDENTS WILL COME OVER AND SHOP IN OUR SHOPPING CENTER. SO WE PROVIDE IT CROSSWALKS FROM THERE'S A PEDESTRIAN EGRESS AND

[01:45:06]

YOU THINK, OKAY, YOU'RE NOT THE CAR ISN'T GOING ANYWHERE, SO IT ISN'T USING A LOT OF ENERGY, RIGHT? BUT IT TURNS OUT THAT IT PRODUCES MORE AIR POLLUTION WHEN IT'S IDLING THAN WHEN IT'S GOING AT 70 MILES AN HOUR. SO IT WOULD BE GOOD TO HAVE A SIGN OR TWO. AND I SEE IT. I DON'T KNOW IF THE ONLY REASON I SEE IT IN FRONT OF SHOPRITE IS BECAUSE THAT'S ONE OF THE FEW PLACES I GO TO IN THE SHOPPING CENTER, OR IF THAT'S THE PLACE THAT PEOPLE ARE MOST LIKELY TO DROP SOMEBODY OFF AND WAIT FOR THEM, I DON'T KNOW, CAN I DO THAT? YEAH, SURE. WELL, AGREE TO THAT. THAT'S FINE. THANK YOU. THAT'S A GOOD THOUGHT. ARE THESE GOING TO BE LIKE LEVEL TWO CHARGERS THAT THAT TAKE A LONG TIME OR ARE THEY GOING TO BE THOSE HIGH SPEED CHARGERS DC CHARGER TYPE THINGS. THEY'RE GOING TO I DON'T THINK THEY'RE GOING TO BE THE REAL HIGH SPEED ONES. I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE ENOUGH POWER FOR THAT LEVEL TWO. MORE THAN LIKELY THEY'RE MOSTLY JUST LIKE, OKAY, AND WHY WOULDN'T WE DO HIGH SPEED? WHY WOULD SHOPRITE OR PLAZA NOT DO A HIGH CHECK ON THE POWER? THE POWER NEEDS FOR A HIGH CHARGING STATION, SEE IF WE HAVE THE POWER FOR IT? IS THAT ALREADY SOMETHING YOU'VE CHECKED? I MEAN, AS A TOWN, WE WOULD LIKE TO TELL PEOPLE THAT THERE IS HIGH SPEED ONES THAT WE TYPICALLY USE IN SOME OF OUR OTHER SITES, OFFICE BUILDINGS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. BUT YOU HAVEN'T CHECKED IF THERE IS A POSSIBILITY OF A HIGH SPEED.

CORRECT. WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING YOU GUYS COULD CHECK? THAT WOULD BE REALLY APPRECIATED. THANK YO.

OKAY. THERE'S ALSO THERE'S ALSO WHAT COMES WITH THE HIGHER SPEED CHARGERS IS YOU NEED MORE SPACE BECAUSE THESE BIG THERE'S A LOT OF EQUIPMENT. THERE'S A LOT OF OKAY. THE EQUIPMENT'S LIKE DOUBLE OR TRIPLE THE SIZE. SO YOU NEED TO HAVE SPACE TO DO IT AS WELL. I MEAN JUST CHECK INTO IT. IT'S NICE TO HAVE THAT IN MONTGOMERY. I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TOO MANY OF THE HIGH SPEED ONES. SO I DO HAVE ONE QUESTION ABOUT THE EV CHARGERS, BUT WAS THERE ANY CONSIDERATION GIVEN TO MAKING ONE OF THEM ADA ACCESSIBLE? MAKE AN, EXCUSE ME, AN ACCESSIBLE SPACE ACCESSIBLE.

WE COULD WE COULD PUT A HANDICAP SIGN ON ONE OF THEM. YEAH IT WOULD HAVE. IT WOULD NEED LOADING AREA LOADING ZONE TOO. SO YOU WOULD NEED TO SHIFT IT TO CREATE LIKE THE FIVE FOOT

[01:50:02]

THAT THAT WOULD BE GOOD. YEAH THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. THANK YOU. SO IF YOU DO THAT CAN PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE HANDICAP STICKERS ACTUALLY STILL USE IT? THAT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION.

THEY DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER. DO YOU KNOW THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO USE IT? I WOULD THINK. YEAH.

THEN THAT WOULD LIMIT MOST PEOPLE THAT WOULD JUST ELIMINATE ONE OF THE FOUR CHARGERS BECAUSE NOT MANY HANDICAPPED PEOPLE WILL PROBABLY USE IT. YEAH, BUT THAT'S A GOOD THING TO VERIFY.

YEAH, YEAH. MAYBE THAT WOULD BE GOOD TO DOUBLE CHECK BECAUSE IT'S NOT ACCESSIBLE SPACES.

TECHNICALLY YOU HAVE NO DEFICIT, RIGHT. IT'S AN EXTRA. YEAH I MEAN I DON'T KNOW OF ANYBODY THAT THIS IS A REALLY BIG PARKING LOT WITH AMPLE SPACE. I HAVE NEVER, EVER, EVER SEEN EVERY SPACE TAKEN UP IN THIS THING. SO I THINK IT WOULD BE EVEN LIKE THE HIGH. LIKE HIGH.

WE COULD. IT'S I DON'T THINK SPACE IS REALLY THE ISSUE IN A LOT OF THE AREAS HERE. CERTAINLY UP BY THE, YOU KNOW, BY SHOPRITE. EVERYONE DRIVES AROUND AND TRIES TO PARK THERE, BUT ESPECIALLY IN THAT AREA OVER THERE, RARELY FULL. SO AGAIN, THAT WOULD BE APPRECIATED. SO IF YOU CAN LOOK IN THAT, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. THANK YOU. THE OTHER COMMENTS FROM OUR PROFESSIONALS.

BOARD MEMBERS. YEAH. GOOD. I HAVE A QUESTION FOR RICH. DO YO. SO THE ORIGINAL PLANS LANDSCAPING PLANS, DO WE HAVE ACCESS TO THOSE. WOULD WE HAVE WE CAN LOOK MAYBE WE CAN GET SOME OLD AERIALS. OKAY. THAT MIGHT HELP. OKAY. SO BETWEEN THE TWO THEN YOU'LL KNOW WHICH NEEDS TO BE REPLANTED TO. I WAS HERE WHEN THEY PUT ME ON 15, 20 YEARS AGO WHEN THEY WERE IN AND I KNOW THERE WAS MORE THAN ONE NOW. OKAY. AND THEN THERE'S ONE OF THE NOTES SAID THERE'S SOME BRADFORD PEARS IN THERE. LOTS, LOTS OF BRADFORD PEARS UNFORTUNATELY IN THE THAT ARE PLANTED IN THE PARKING LOT. YES. THOSE ARE COLLECTOR'S ITEMS. NOW PLACE THEM. WELL THEN I THINK THAT EVERYBODY WHO LIVES NEARBY IS PROBABLY GOT OKAY. I REMEMBER BACK WHEN THE BANK WAS APPROVED OR THE LANDSCAPING FOR THE BANK WAS APPROVED, WE THOUGHT THAT THEY DIDN'T PRODUCE SEEDS.

REMEMBER BACK WHEN WE THOUGHT THAT BRADFORD PEARS DIDN'T PRODUCE SEEDS? YEAH, YEAH, THAT'S THE ONLY REASON I VOTED FOR THEM BACK THEN. OH, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD REMOVE THEM, BUT WE CERTAINLY WE NEVER WANT TO PLANT THEM AGAIN. RIGHT. BUT YOU'LL ASSESS THE HEALTH OF THEM OF SOME OF THOSE TREES BECAUSE THEY'RE SOME OF THEM ARE LOOKING PRETTY. YEAH. WE ARE NOT CUTTING ANY TREES OR REMOVING ANY TREES. NO, NO, NO, NO. UNLESS THEY'RE DYING. YEAH. UNLESS THEY'RE DEA.

SO IS IT. SO CLEARLY WE'RE. SO THIS IS ALSO CONTINGENT UPON ALL OF THOSE TREES BEING PUT BACK I.

YEAH. RIGHT. BECAUSE YOU WERE KIND OF WAFFLING ON THAT. SO I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR THAT THAT'S PART OF THIS. AS LONG AS THE INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE. I IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S A LITTLE UP IN THE AIR WHETHER THE ORIGINAL PLANS. I THINK YOU WERE DECIDING TO HAVE A MEETING AND SEE WHERE WHERE THINGS FALL. SO THAT'S THAT'S A COMMITMENT THAT YOU'RE MAKING. SO THANK YOU. I THINK THE AERIALS WOULD BE EVIDENCE. YEAH. THAT'S WHAT THEY WERE. WE CAN HELP HELP WITH THE SELECTIO.

THAT WOULD HOLD UP OKAY. GREAT. BEST AS POSSIBLE. OKAY OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OKAY. ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS. OKAY THEN PLEASE COME FORWARD. OKAY. HELLO, SIR. COULD WE HAVE YOUR NAME? AND IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, I'LL LET YOU KNOW. SOUTHERN TOWNSHIP OF SUMNER. AND, SIR, COULD YOU SPELL IT? IS THIS IS THAT WORKING? WITH THE SHOPPING CENTER THAT IS CALLED TOWN SHOPPING CENTER. OVER THE YEARS, THE BUILDINGS CHANGE IS THE ONLY CHANGE USED. NEW BUILDINGS WERE PLANTED THAT WERE PUT IN AT ONE TIME. IT STAYED THE SAME. AND IT'S ALWAYS GOOD TO HAVE AN URBAN JUNGLE AROUND JUST TO PULL US OUT. NO TREES AND STILL GOOD AND THEN I KIND OF SAID THAT WE CAN TAKE CARE OF BOTH TREES, BECAUSE THE ISLANDS ARE SMALL,

[01:55:05]

HELLO? OKAY, NOW TRY. GO AHEAD. OKAY. LET'S TRY AGAIN. SO I AM BACK FROM THE COMMITTEE. I LIVE IN TOWN. 293 GRIGGSTOWN ROAD. I HAVE TAKEN A LOOK AT THESE PLANS AND I THINK THAT THE NEW FACADE IS AT ODDS WITH ITS PURPOSE. THE ARCHES HIDE THE STOREFRONTS. THE MASSIVE ROOFLINE, DOORS, THE COLUMNS AND THE COLUMNS ARE COMPOSED OF SEVERAL HORIZONTAL SECTIONS THAT MAKE THEM EVEN SHORTER THAN THEY ARE. FURTHERMORE, THE COLUMNS ARE GOING TO BE COVERED WITH SOME SORT OF A PLASTIC COVER, WHEREAS IN THE CURRENT CONFIGURATION WE HAVE NICE OLD SOLID BRICKS AND ALSO MORE VISIBILITY. IF YOU COMPARE THE TWO PICTURES OF WHAT WE HAVE NOW AND WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED, YOU CAN SEE MUCH BETTER. THE STORES THAT YOU ARE GOING TO GO TO THAN IN THE NEW CONFIGURATION. GRANTED, WHAT IS REALLY NEEDED IS GOOD SIGNAGE AND IT SHOULD BE UNIFORM AND LEGIBLE AND SAME COLOR, SAME SIZE. BEST IN CAPITAL LETTERS SANS SERIF, ETC. IF THE STORES ARE INSIST ON THEIR LOGOS, THERE IS A WAY TO DEAL WITH THAT. YOU CAN HAVE THE LOGO ON THE LEFT OF THE INSCRIPTION AND THEN THE NICE LEGIBLE SIGN. BUT WHAT I REALLY WANT TO TALK ABOUT, OF COURSE, IS ABOUT THE TREE PLANTING. I REMEMBER WHEN THE SHOPPING CENTER WAS REDONE

[02:00:07]

THE GRAND UNION SHOPPING CENTER WAS VERY SORRY THAT IT CAME IN THE NEW SHOPPING CENTER THAT IS.

THERE WERE SOME QUESTIONABLE CHOICES MADE AT THE TIME THAT WE LIVE WITH EVEN NOW, MEANING THAT THE ENTIRE CENTER OF THE OF THE PARKING LOT WAS A MONOCULTURE OF COLOR REPAIRS. AND OF COURSE, MANY OF THEM DIED. AND ON THE WHOLE, THE PLANTING WAS NOT WELL MAINTAINED OVER THE YEARS. AND OF COURSE, RIGHT NOW WE HAVE A SEMI-DESERT THERE WHICH EVEN WITHOUT THE PLANTINGS WOULD HAVE BEEN A GIANT HEAT ISLAND IN THE CENTER OF MONTGOMERY. AND THAT HAS TO BE DEALT WITH. IF YOU PUT IN MORE TREES, YOU WILL HAVE LESS RUNOFF BECAUSE THE TREES WILL ABSORB THE RUNNING WATER AND YOU WILL MITIGATE THE EFFECT OF THE HEAT ISLAND AND OF COURSE, A BETTER LANDSCAPING WILL DRAW THE PEOPLE IN. IF YOU EVER NOTICE WHERE PEOPLE PARK WHEN THEY GO TO THE MOVIES, THERE ARE FOUR SPOTS THAT PEOPLE ARE FIGHTING FOR. THAT'S WHERE THEY ARE NEAR THE BANK, WHERE THERE ARE BIG TREES AND THAT'S WHERE THEY PARK. SO THESE ARE MY SUGGESTIONS. YOU HAVE A LOT OF VARIANCES GOING HERE AND YOU COULD REALLY ASK NICELY FOR THE LANDSCAPING TO LIVE UP TO, TO THOSE GRANDIOSE PLANS THAT ARE BEFORE YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YO. OKAY. IS THERE ANYBODY ELSE PUBLIC COMMENTS? NOPE. MOTION TO CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT. SO MOVED. SECOND. I'VE. OPEN FOR DISCUSSION. GOOD BOARD DISCUSSION. YEAH. SO I'M LOOKING AT THE LANDSCAPE DESIGN AND PLANTINGS AND WHAT YOU'RE THE APPLICANT HAS REQUESTED WAIVERS FROM THE REQUIREMENTS TO SUBMIT A TREE REMOVAL PLAN AND A LANDSCAPE PLAN. SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD WE'RE BEING REQUESTED TO GRANT THAT WAIVER. AND I'M PERSONALLY NOT IN FAVOR OF THAT. RIGHT. I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A TRUE LANDSCAPE PLAN. I THINK IT SHOULD BE MODERNIZED TO BRING IT UP TO SO IT ISN'T THE HEAT DESERT IN THERE. AND WE SHOULD BE PUTTING IN SOME MORE PLANTINGS AND TREES IN THERE. SO PERSONALLY, I DON'T AGREE WITH THAT. THAT WAIVER REQUEST RIGHT. SHE WANTS MORE TREES. TREES. I AGREE WITH YOU. DO YOU AGREE WITH ME? ANYTHING ELSE ON THAT OTHER THAN THE LANDSCAPE PLAN? I KNOW THAT, AND I WOULD ASK THAT OUR OUR TOWNSHIP PROFESSIONALS ACTUALLY LOOK AT THE SIDEWALK ALONG 206. IT'S PROBABLY ADEQUATE, BUT I SINCE IT WASN'T EVALUATED, I'D LIKE FOR THEM TO ASSESS WHETHER IT'S CURRENTLY ADEQUATE AND ANYTHING ELSE NEEDS TO BE DONE THERE TO ENSURE PROPER LIGHTING ALONG THERE. BUT LET ME JUST ASK HOW HOW WE DO THAT RIGHT. SO THE ONLY WAY TO DO THAT IS TO ACTUALLY GO OUT THERE WITH WE NEED TO HAVE A PERFORMANCE STANDARD. WHAT IS THE STANDARD THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT. AND THEN IT NEEDS TO BE EVALUATED WITH A LIGHT METER IN ORDER TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THE EXISTING LIGHTING OUT THERE IS SUFFICIENT. BASED UPON THAT STANDARD. SO OR YOU COULD DRIVE BY AND SEE IT. I MEAN, THAT'S THE OTHER THING IS, YOU KNOW, IT'S DARK NOW. YOU CAN GO OVER THERE AND SEE IF IT WORKS RIGHT.

WELL, THEN THAT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU NEED US FOR, RIGHT? I MEAN, THAT'S, THAT'S THAT'S A STANDARD. YOU CAN JUST DO IT. YEAH. SO. WELL, I GUESS I'M NOT ASKING. THE TOWNSHIP PROFESSIONALS HAVE TO DO THE MEASUREMENTS, BUT I THINK THE APPLICANT SHOULD DO THE MEASUREMENTS. AND YOU GUYS COULD EVALUATE IF THAT'S SUFFICIENT OR NOT. WELL, THAT'S THAT'S THAT'S REASONABLE. YES. YEAH. YEAH. THAT THAT WOULD THAT'S WHAT I, THAT'S WHAT I MEANT. LIKE THEY

[02:05:04]

I SAID, WHAT DID WHAT WAS DONE OUT THERE. THAT'S ALL REFERENCE IS THAT IT IS MORE FOR A REFERENCE POINT. NOT EXACTLY. NOT THAT YOU'RE GOING TO FOLLOW SUIT. I SEE WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM, BUT. WE ARE NOT SETTING A PRECEDENCE IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR. OKAY, OKAY. WHAT WHAT DO WE DO NOW? OKAY. SO AT THIS STAGE, ARE YOU GOING THROUGH SUGGESTED CONDITIONS NOW? WELL, NO, I WAS GOING TO SAY ACTUALLY, DO WE IF YOU'RE DONE, IF THE BOARD. YES. CLOSING ITS EXECUTIVE DISCUSSION I CAN GO THROUGH THE CONDITIONS THAT I'VE NOTED DOWN. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE ONE SUGGESTION FOR DOCUMENTATION ON THE SIGNS. THIS CENTER IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE CENTER UP BELLEMEADE PLAZA. OKAY. AND THE WAY WE HANDLED IT THERE, IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE THAT THE ZONING OFFICER HAS THE CLEAREST GUIDANCE POSSIBLE FOR DETERMINING WHETHER SIGNS ARE CONFORMING. WELL, AFTER THIS APPROVAL, SO THAT, YOU KNOW, APPLICANTS COME IN, IT'S A NEW STORE, AND THEY WANT TO PUT A SIGN UP THAT HE CAN READILY SEE WHETHER IT CONFORMS OR NOT. AND THERE'S NOT A REASON FOR THEM TO COME BACK FOR AN AMENDED SITE PLAN OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. WHAT WE DID WAS WE HAD EACH OF THE FACADES BECAUSE WE WENT THROUGH A SIMILAR EXERCISE TRYING TO LOCATE SIGNS IN THE PROPER WAY, IN THE PROPER RELATIONSHIP TO THE ARCHITECTURE. AND WHAT WE DID WAS WE HAD EACH OF THE SIGN AREAS WHERE A SIGN COULD BE LOCATED WAS DIMENSIONED AS TO THE AREA DIMENSIONED AS TO THE HEIGHT AND WIDTH, BUT FURTHERMORE, IT WAS ACTUALLY DIMENSIONED SO THAT IT COULD BE LOCATED WITHIN THAT SPACE ON THE PANEL, THE ARCHITECTURAL PANEL, SO THAT YOU COULD SEE, YOU KNOW, IT'S A FOOT UP FROM HERE AND IT'S TWO FEET OVER FROM HERE.

THAT WAY YOU CAN LOCATE IT AND IN THE FIELD HE CAN VERIFY THAT IT'S BEEN CONSTRUCTED AS NORMAL.

AND IT ALSO ASSISTS WITH PERMIT REVIEW FOR SIGNS, BECAUSE YOU DON'T NEED A SITE PLAN TO GET A SIGNED PERMIT. AND THIS APPLICANT SHOULDN'T HAVE TO COME IN FOR A SITE PLAN EVERY TIME THEY NEED A SIGN. SO THAT'S A VERY GOOD WAY OF DOING IT. YEAH. THE OTHER THE OTHER CONDITION.

SO THAT'S A THAT'S A RECOMMENDATION. THE OTHER RECOMMENDATION IS THAT AND THIS WAS NOT IN MY LIGHTING SECTION, BUT THIS WAS IN THE SIGN SECTION ABOUT THE ILLUMINATION FROM SIGNS. IT'S LIMITED TO ONE FOOT CANDLE AT A DISTANCE FROM TWO FEET FROM THE SIGN. SO THE SIGNS ILLUMINATED SIGNS AREN'T OVERLY BRIGHT AND THERE SHOULD BE A CONDITION THAT THEY COMPLY WITH THAT. OKAY, SO I WILL GO THROUGH THE CONDITIONS AND THEN OF COURSE ANY COMMENTS OR ANYTHING ADDITIONAL WOULD BE WELCOMED. SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE BOARD IS

[02:10:01]

THAT'S UNDERSTOOD. BUT ARE WE AGREEING TO CERTAIN THINGS THAT ARE AS WE REQUIRED OR AS OUR PROFESSIONAL? MR. SULLIVAN SAT AND WENT THROUGH STUFF WITH THEM THAT THAT CAME THROUGH FROM THE SITE PLANNING COMMISSION? YEAH, THAT, THAT, THAT CAN GO FORWARD. BUT I MEAN, I MEAN, WE SHOULD MOVE FORWARD ON SOME STUFF. YEAH. THOSE PORTIONS ARE WHERE WE DON'T HAVE A DISPUTE AND WHERE WE HAVE. BUT FOR THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE NEED VARIANCES. I THINK THIS WHOLE LANDSCAPING AGREEMENT SHOULD BE 100%, 100%. YEAH, THAT SHOULD BE CARRIED. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO IF I UNDERSTAND THIS TONIGHT, YOU WANT TO APPROVE THE APPLICANTS VARIANCES NOT ALL VARIANCES.

WHAT WAS DECIDED AS FAR AS THE SIGNS. DO WE HAVE THEM. DO YOU HAVE LIKE A LIST OF THE CONDITIONS. SURE. LOOK AT THE LOOK AT PAGE 23 OF OKAY. IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT I'VE GOT IT HERE.

BUT WE CAN COME BACK ABOUT WHAT WE AGREED ON. WE JUST LAWNS AND LANDSCAPING. YEAH. OKAY. WELL THEY ALL RIGHT. BUT WHAT THEY WERE SEEKING WAS SIMPLY A DESIGN WAIVER OR SUBMITTING A LANDSCAPING PLAN. THEY WERE NOT SEEKING A VARIANCE. SO I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT AT THIS STAGE WHETHER THE LANDSCAPING IS OF SUCH IMPORTANCE THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO MOVE AHEAD WITH APPROVAL OF THE VARIANCES. MEAN, I THINK SO, I THINK SO. I THINK SO, YEAH. I THINK I DON'T KNOW IF WE ARE ALL ON THE SAME AGREEMENT. I THINK IF WE ARE NOT ON. YEAH, MAYBE THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. DO WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THE LANDS WITH HAVING THE LANDSCAPING CONCERN OR WE DON'T MOVE FORWARD AND JUST HOLD IT TILL THE LANDSCAPING, WHICH I THINK TO ME, I MEAN, WE NEED TO MOVE FORWARD. MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT THE APPLICANT WAS READILY AVAILABLE TO AGREE IN GOOD HARMONY WITH RICH BARTOLO'S SUGGESTIONS AND COMPLY WITH THE LANDSCAPING PLAN, AS IT WAS

[02:15:04]

AND TO CONFIRM THAT IT'S DONE WELL, NOT TO CONFIRM IT'S DONE. BUT IF THEY'RE BOARD MEMBERS WHO FEEL IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO SEE WHAT IT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE SO THAT THEY COULD HAVE A DIALOG WITH MR. BARTOLONI AND SAY, YEAH, BUT, YOU KNOW, GO DOWN AND LOOK AT EXACTLY, EXACTLY. BUT THEN WE'VE ALREADY GIVEN THEM WHAT THEY WANT WITHOUT GETTING WHAT PERHAPS WE WANT. SO I MEAN, THERE'S A NEGOTIATED CONDITION TO THAT AGREEMENT. NO, BUT IT'S A CONDITION OF APPROVAL.

WHATEVER. SO OKAY. IT'S NOT IT'S NOT THAT THEY CAN GET A PLANT. I LIKE THE IDEA OF A SUBCOMMITTEE HAVING THEM LOOK AT IT. I THINK THERE'S A HUGE DIFFERENCE FROM WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY PLANTED AND WHAT THEIR CURRENT STANDARDS OR WHAT SOME PEOPLE ARE REQUESTING. AND I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT ABOUT THAT. SO I'M NOT SURE IF COMPLYING WITH WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED IS I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S RELEVANT. IF ALL THE BOARD MEMBERS FEEL THAT'S A RELEVANT THING OR THAT WHAT'S MORE IMPORTANT IS WHAT WOULD BE DONE NOW, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO DO, JUST I NEED GUIDANCE. OKAY.

I THINK WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY DONE COULD BE THE FLOOR. I'M ALSO LOOKING AT WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY DONE. YEAH, BUT THAT COULD BE IF THERE'S A KIND OF TREE THAT WAS PLANTED AND IT DIED, DO YOU WANT TO HAVE IT PLANTED AGAIN? NO, NO, I'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO CHANGE SPECIES. RIGHT. MORE DESIRABLE AND MORE PROBABILITY OF SURVIVING. YEAH. BECAUSE I AGREE. GREAT. OKAY. I MEAN, I

[02:20:08]

ARE WE ASKING THEM TO CHANGE EVERYTHING? BECAUSE, I MEAN, WE HAVE TO BE A LITTLE MORE REASONABLE. WELL, NOT JUST THAT, BUT I MEAN, THERE'S DEGREES OF CHANGE HERE. SO IF IT'S CHANGING THE PARKING LOT, THEN NO, I DON'T THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THEY THEY WILL HAVE TO COME BACK TO THE BOARD TO SHOW THE RECONFIGURED PARKING LOT. YEAH. SO THAT'S WHY I THINK IT'S EITHER IF YOU'RE AMENABLE TO APPROVING THEIR APPLICATION, VOTE ON BOTH OPTIONS, OR DO YOU WANT TO DO REDO EVERYTHING OR DO YOU WANT TO GO WITH THE ORIGINAL PLAN THAT WAS APPROVED WHEN THIS WAS PUT TOGETHER? WELL, NOT A VOTE NECESSARILY, BUT HOW ABOUT WE'LL CALL IT THE CONSENSUS OF THE BOARD BECAUSE WE'RE NOT READY YET TO DO ANY MOTIONS. SO KAREN, YOU'RE THE PLEASE GO AHEAD. I'M JUST SO JUST TO GIVE EVERYBODY GUIDANCE TONIGHT. DO WE HAVE BOARD MEMBERS WHO FEEL THAT THE APPLICANT SHOULD RESTORE WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED FOR THE SITE, NOT MORE.

JUST RESTORE THAT. DO WE HAVE ANY MEMBERS WHO FEEL THAT'S A GOOD IDEA? RESTORE. I'M ON THAT.

ALL RIGHT. SO I MEAN, THAT SHOULD BE THE POINT. YEAH, CERTAINLY. I'M UNDERSTOOD. OKAY.

THE ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE FOR THE APPLICANT TO WORK WITH MR. BARTOLONI AND A BOARD SUBCOMMITTEE TO PRODUCE A LANDSCAPING PLAN, WHICH NOW WILL HAVE MORE TREES AND WHICH WILL BE DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO, SO, SO THE SECOND ONE OPENS UP THE POSSIBILITY THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO RECONFIGURE. YEAH, IT WILL BE THE PARKING LOT. I AM SAYING USE THE ONE AS THE FLOOR. THE ORIGINAL PLAN. BUT I'M SURE WE CAN HAVE A COUPLE OF, YOU KNOW, TWEAKS TO IT, TO THE SENSE OF ADDING MORE TREES AND ALSO TO CHANGE THE SPECIES OF THINGS THAT HAVE DIE. YEAH. BECAUSE MY WORRY IS THAT IF WE RECONFIGURE, WE WILL HAVE LESS SPACE FOR THE ONES THAT WE ALREADY HAVE MARKED OUT. I THINK THAT'S MY CONCERN ON THAT. AND IT'S A REASONABLE CONCERN. WE REALLY LIKE TO AVOID HAVING TO RECONFIGURE THE PARKING. I DON'T THINK THAT I'M HAVING MINE, THAT YOU HAVE TO. IT'S GONE WELL BEYOND WHAT OUR PROPOSAL WAS. WE WERE JUST DOING A FACELIFT OF THESE BUILDINGS. WE'RE NOW TALKING ABOUT POTENTIALLY REDESIGNING THE ENTIRE PARKING LOT. I DON'T I DON'T HAVE IN MIND REDESIGNING THE WHOLE PARKING LOT. JUST BECAUSE IT'S NOT THE ORIGINAL PLAN DOESN'T MEAN YOU WOULDN'T ADD MORE TREES AT THE ENDS OF THE BUILDING. BUT BUT THEY'VE AGREED TO THAT. WE CAN SUPPLEMENT. YEAH. LOOKING AT ADDING LANDSCAPING AT THE ENDS OF BUILDINGS. I'VE ALREADY AGREED TO THAT. YEAH. SO. BUT THAT'S NOT THE ORIGINAL PLAN. THAT'S WHAT I HAVE IN MIND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT OKAY, SO THE ORIGINAL PLANNING PLUS SOME ADDITIONAL PLANTINGS AT THE ENDS OF BUILDINGS, WE'RE PROPOSE A PLAN FOR MR. BARTOLOME'S APPROVAL OR IF THERE NEEDS TO BE A SUBCOMMITTEE. FINE. WE'LL DO IT. DOESN'T HAVE TO BE END AT THE END OF THE BUILDINGS. IT COULD BE IN THE EXISTING PLACE.

IF THERE IS A POSSIBILITY OF ADDING MORE TREES, MORE TREES, MORE TREES. BUT LANDSCAPING IS MORE THAN TREES. THERE'S AMPLE OPPORTUNITIES TO DO OTHER THINGS. WE TALK ABOUT PLANTERS.

I THINK IT'S BIGGER THAN JUST THAN JUST THE PLANTERS. THE PLANTERS IS A GOOD POINT. AND THEY ARE SAYING THAT THEY WOULD DO THAT. BUT IF YOU'RE TRYING TO PUT MORE TREES, YOU HAVE TO MOVE THE PARKING LOT THAT TO THE APPLICANT. I DON'T THINK THAT WOULD MAKE SENSE. RIGHT? YEAH. I MEAN, THAT I DON'T THINK IS WHAT WE AS A PLANNING LOOK, THERE MIGHT BE AREAS THAT WE CAN ADD, TREES THAT WON'T REQUIRE RECONFIGURING. I MEAN, I CAN MAKE THAT COMMITMENT, BUT WE REALLY I HOPE YOU CAN UNDERSTAND OUR, OUR ISSUE HERE THAT SO I WANT TO UNDERSTAND SO MR. BRIAN HAMILTON THEN YOU UNDERSTOOD IT TO BE THAT NOTHING IS GETTING CHANGED AS ADDING EXTRA SPACE FOR TREES AT THE PARKING LOT. YOU UNDERSTOOD THE ADDITIONAL TO BE SOME PLANTERS AROUND THE SHOPPING CENTER. ADD SOME MORE SPACES. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YEAH, EXACTLY. BUT NOT MOVING THE PARKING LOT TO BUILD MORE GREEN SPACE. OKAY, SO I THINK WE MAY BE TALKING TWO DIFFERENT THINGS HERE. SO I DON'T KNOW HOW WE RESOLVE THAT. MAYBE A SUBCOMMITTEE IS THE ONLY

[02:25:04]

NOW WHAT? YEAH, I THINK THAT'S THAT'S THAT. YEAH. IT'S GOING TO GO BACK TO US. IT'S GOING TO KEEP GOING BACK AND FORTH. WELL, IN THAT SITUATION I, I'VE HAD THESE TYPE OF CONDITIONS BEFORE.

IF, IF WE FAIL TO AGREE WITH EITHER YOUR CONSULTANT OR YOUR COMMITTEE, THEN WE CAN ALWAYS COME BACK TO THE FULL BOARD AND MAKE OUR CASE. OKAY? OKAY. I WOULD AGREE TO THAT SORT OF THE TYPICAL PROCESS. I MEAN, I FEEL PRETTY CONFIDENT WE'RE GOING TO REACH AGREEMENT WITH MR. BARTOLO AND YOUR AND IN A SUBCOMMITTEE, IF YOU WANT TO DO THE SUBCOMMITTEE, WHICH WOULD BE FOCUSED JUST ON THE LANDSCAPING AND THE TREES AND. RIGHT. YEAH, IT WOULD JUST BE ON LANDSCAPING, EVERYTHING ELSE. HOPEFULLY YOU'LL AGREE. AND APPROVE THAT. SO THE OTHERS WOULD BE A CONDITIONAL ON THIS COMING TO AN AGREEMENT ON THIS. RIGHT. OKAY. SO THAT'S FINE. THEN WE CAN MOVE FORWARD ON THAT. SO SUBCOMMITTEE CAN BE THERE. ALL RIGHT. DO YOU WANT TO. WELL LET LET'S GO THROUGH THE REST OF THE CONDITIONS. AND THEN YOU CAN DECIDE TONIGHT IF YOU WANT TO APPOINT A SUBCOMMITTEE TONIGHT AS WELL. ALL RIGHT. SO I THINK WE HAD ILLUMINATED SIGNAGE WITH THE EXCEPTION OF SHOPRITE. WILL GO OFF BY 11 P.M. THE LIGHTING WILL BE AT 2700 K COLOR TEMPERATURE. THE APPLICANT WILL AGREE WITH THE RECOMMENDATIONS IN THE MEMOS OF LANDSCAPE COMMISSION LANDSCAPE COMMITTEE IN OPEN SPACE, A DIRECTOR WITH THE FOLLOWING EXCEPTIONS. THERE WILL BE NO SOLAR PANELS. I DON'T THINK THE APPLICANT WANTED TO DO DOWNSPOUT PLANTERS. THERE MAY BE OTHER PLANTERS THAT THEY CAN AGREE TO WITH MR. BARTOLONI. THE SIGNAGE WILL BE INTERNALLY LIT AND I DON'T KNOW, IS THERE GOING TO BE A HEAT EXCHANGE HVAC? MR. NO, NO HEAT EXCHANGE, APAC. THE APPLICANT WILL INSTALL ADDITIONAL NO IDLING SIGNS. THE APPLICANT WILL PROVIDE A PLAN SHOWING THE SIGN AREAS DIMENSIONED ON EACH ARCHITECTURAL PANEL. THEY WILL COMPLY WITH THE ONE FOOT CANDLE ILLUMINATION. AND I'M NOT CLEAR. WAS THERE AGREEMENT THAT ONE OF THE PARKING SPACES FOR THE EV CHARGES IS GOING TO BE HANDICAP ACCESSIBLE? YES. OKAY. YES WILL BE RIGHT. YES. AND WE ALSO DISCUSSED THE HIGH SPEED. THE HIGH SPEED WAS SOMETHING. YEAH.

THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO KNOW FROM THEM. ALL RIGHT. BUT THEY'RE JUST GOING TO IF, IF THAT'S POSSIBLE. BUT IT REDUCES THE NUMBER OF EV SPACES BECAUSE THE CHARGING STATION HAS TO BE SO BIG. ARE YOU SAYING THAT IF YOU DID A HANDICAPPED ONE THEN YOU WOULD MAKE YOU'D STILL HAVE FOUR, RIGHT? ONE PLUS THREE. YEAH. YEAH, THEY STILL HAVE FOUR. SO IT IS ONLY IF YOU USE THE HIGH SPEED ONE. THEN YOU REDUCE SPACE BECAUSE THEY ARE MUCH BIGGER. IT WILL CUT DOWN ON BECAUSE THEY THEY HAVE SPACES WILL HAVE A FIVE FOOT AISLE FOR HANDICAP ACCESSIBILITY, FIVE FOOT AISLE. OH SO AROUND IT THERE'S RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT. YEAH. YEAH. AND ARE YOU SAYING IF IT'S HIGH SPEED THEN YOU WOULD GO DOWN TO THREE, OR WOULD YOU STILL BE ABLE TO STAY FOUR HIGH SPEED. WE'LL HAVE TO INVESTIGATE THAT FURTHER. THERE'S A LOT THERE'S A LOT THAT GOES INTO THE CHARGERS. YEAH. THE ACTUAL CHARGING EQUIPMENT ITSELF IS OBVIOUSLY DIFFERENT. THEN THERE'S ALSO OTHER ELECTRICAL EQUIPMENT THAT'S THAT'S LARGER TAKES UP SPACE. AND YOU MAY NOT THEY MAY NOT HAVE THE ACTUAL, YOU KNOW, CAPACITY TO DO THEM EITHER. SO THEY HAVE TO THEIR INVESTIGATION IS INTO THAT WOULD BE ALL PRETTY ENCOMPASSING. IT WOULD BE A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS THEY HAVE TO LOOK INTO. ARE YOU SAYING THAT THEY WOULDN'T YOU DON'T SEE THE HIGH SPEED BEING A POSSIBILITY THERE? I'M SORRY I MISSED THAT. IT'S UNLIKELY. UNLIKELY? YEAH. I DIDN'T HEAR THAT FROM THE APPLICANT. OR ARE THEY TRYING TO KEEP US IN THE DARK OR ME IN THE DARK? I DON'T KNOW, I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE APPLICANT. OKAY. IS THERE ANY. ARE YOU SAYING

[02:30:06]

BUT THE LITTLE I KNOW ABOUT THAT THEY'RE GOING TO THE HIGHER. IT DOES REQUIRE A LOT MORE EQUIPMENT AND CAPACITY. WE'RE NOT EVEN SURE THAT WE HAVE THE POWER TO DO IT. YEAH. AND EXPENSE AND EXPENSE. I MEAN, I'M SURE THEY THEY CAN DO THE EXPENSE FOR US IF THEY DON'T HAVE THE POWER, THEN I'M CONCERNED THE EXPENSE. OKAY, OKAY. SO WOULD YOU THEN LET US KNOW THAT YOU CHECKED INTO IT AND GIVE US A FULL REPORT ON THAT? YOU JUST DON'T HAVE THE POWER AT THE WHATEVER BANK. AND YEAH, IF YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, PROVE YOUR POINT, SO TO SPEAK.

WE WOULD APPRECIATE THAT FOR. ALL RIGHT. SO THOSE ARE THE CONDITIONS I HAVE IN MY LIST. I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY HAS ANY OTHERS. THAT'S WHAT WE DON'T DISCUSS OKAY. AND THE ONLY OTHER ONE I HAD I MENTIONED WAS THE CHECKING THE SIDEWALK ALONG 206. BUT I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF THE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS WANT THAT DONE OR NOT. I MEAN, WHO WOULD BE DOING THAT? BRIAN? THE AGAIN, LIKE THE APPLICANT WOULD PROVIDE THE NUMBERS AND OUR PROFESSIONALS WOULD SAY WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S ACCEPTABLE OR NOT. IF THE BOARD DOESN'T WANT TO DO THAT, THAT'S FINE. ALSO, IT'S JUST I THINK THAT'S GOOD. I DON'T SEE THE ABSOLUTE NEED FOR IT. OKAY. SO JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, THE CONDITION WITH RESPECT TO THE LANDSCAPING WILL BE THE APPLICANT WILL RESTORE THE ORIGINAL LANDSCAPING AS WAS APPROVED FOR THAT SITE. AND WE'LL CONFER WITH MR. BARTOLONI AND A SUBCOMMITTEE WHICH WILL BE APPOINTED BY THE BOARD TONIGHT TO. REVIEW ADDITIONAL PLANTINGS AT THE END OF THE BUILDINGS. AND ADDITIONAL PLANTERS, ALL WITH THE GOAL OF ADDING MORE GREEN TO THE SITE, ESPECIALLY WHERE THEY HAVE MORE OF THE CONCRETE AND NO GLASS.

OKAY, I THINK, BUT WE'RE ARE WE LIMITING OURSELVES BY JUST SAYING THOSE THINGS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT ARE VERSUS THERE MAY BE OTHER OPPORTUNITIES. WELL, YOU JUST WANT TO SAY ADDITIONAL PLANTINGS AND TREES. YEAH. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. AND IF AGREEMENT CANNOT BE REACHED BETWEEN THE APPLICANT, MR. BARTOLONI, AND THE SUBCOMMITTEE, THEN THE APPLICANT WILL RETURN TO THE FULL BOARD. YEP. TO MAKE THEIR CASE AS TO WHY THEY CAN'T DO WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED. OKAY. SO THAT BEING THE CASE. SO IT HAS TO BE CARRIED, RIGHT THEN. NO NO NO NO NO, IT DOESN'T WITH THE CAVEAT. OKAY. YEP. OKAY. SO IS THERE A SUBCOMMITTEE OR PEOPLE WHO WOULD LIKE TO BE ON A SUBCOMMITTEE THERE? THAT'S SARAH ROBERTS AND DAVID KEENAN. ANYBODY ELSE ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE? I MEAN, IF THE MEETING IS IN THE DAYTIME, I CAN'T. BUT IF IT'S IN THE EVENINGS, I CAN MAYBE IT CAN BE IN THE EVENINGS. CAN MAKE IT ALTERNATE. HOW'S THAT? DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? OKAY. GOOD. OKAY. SO, MISS ROBERTS, WE ONLY HAVE TWO PEOPLE IN AN ALTERNATE, AND I CAN TELL IF IT'S. IF IT'S. I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS DURING DAYTIME. I'LL RUN INTO EVENING. OH. THEN MAYBE SINCE DAVE CAMPUS IS NOT HERE, HE'S ON THE MEETING AS WELL. OKAY. LET'S PUT REMEMBER, WE NEED LESS THAN A QUORUM, SO WE CAN'T HAVE. WE DON'T NEED THE ENTIRE BOARD. THREE SHOULD BE SUFFICIENT. I THINK THREE IS OKAY. SO ALAN IS THERE. SO GOOD. OTHERWISE, I WAS THINKING THE PERSON WHO'S NOT HERE CAN BE ON THAT. SO YOU'RE SELECTED. ALL RIGHT, SO, MISS, MISS ROBERTS, MISS KEENAN AND MR. KHAN, THAT'S OUR SUBCOMMITTEE. NO, I THINK AARON, IF CAN'T. I'M SORRY.

YEAH. CAN'T CAN'T BE THERE. OKAY. IF WE NEEDED MORE. THAT'S WHY I OFFERED MYSELF. OKAY. SO AT THIS POINT, IS THERE A MOTION THEN TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION WITH THE CONDITIONS OF MEETING WITH. YES. AND THE SUBCOMMITTEE REVIEW? YEAH. I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION WITH THE CONDITIONS AND THE VARIOUS VARIANCES AS OUTLINED. SECOND. YEAH. READY FOR ROLL CALL? YEAH.

BLODGETT. YES. HAMILTON. YES. KEENAN. YES. MAHONEY. YES. MATTHEWS. YES. ROBERTS. YES.

[02:35:09]

[VII. MINUTES - March 11, 2024 – Regular Meeting June 10, 2024 – Regular Meeting October 14, 2024 – Regular Meeting]

AND. KHAN. YES. YEAH. OKAY. JUNE 10TH, 2024. REGULAR MEETING. MOTION TO MOTION TO APPROVE.

MOTION TO APPROVE. SECOND. OKAY. WE BOTH SECONDED. MAHONEY. YES. FARRELL. HE'S NOT HERE.

BLODGETT. YES. KEENAN. YES. ROBERTS. YES. SINGH. YES. THANK YOU. OCTOBER 14TH, 2024. REGULAR MEETING. MOTION TO APPROVE. SO MOVE. SECOND. SECOND. MONEY. YES. ROGER. YES. HAMILTON. YES.

KEENAN. YES. MATTHEWS. YES. YES. SINGH. YES. AND. KHAN. YES. THANK YOU. OKAY. FUTURE MEETINGS DECEMBER 3RD, 2024. SITE PLAN. SUBDIVISION COMMITTEE MEETING IS CANCELED DECEMBER 9TH, 2024.

PLANNING BOARD MEETING IS AT 7 P.M. AS SCHEDULED. AS OF NOW AND DECEMBER 23RD. PLANNING BOARD MEETING IS CANCELED. OKAY, GOOD. THAT'S. I THINK THAT'S A LITTLE TOO CLOSE. WELL, I DIDN'T KNOW WHETHER TODAY WAS TO CLOSE. THAT'S TRUE TOO. THE MEETING

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.